We characters that work together sometimes it is hard for one thread to capture all the discussion. I will begin the Elte Republic Commando discussion.
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Post subject: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:23 pm
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:36 am
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Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad (Counts as a character with Order 66 for the purposes of Commander Effects)
Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (This character costs 1 less when in the same squad as a character with Delta Squad)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Delta Squad ally within 6 squares can move up to its speed. After moving, it can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Similar to the original Boss (giving an immediate shot), but better.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:15 am
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I would change the CE to apply to commandos. Give the old ones and Omega some love.
I would also like to see the Rapport removed from the other characters and changed so that Boss makes them all cost less. Rapport that theoretically applies to themselves, and the same rapport on different characters is a bit of a headache.
And is there a particular reason why they shouldn't have Order 66? I think give them Order 66 and Delta Squad, as descriptors, would be fine.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:45 am
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EDIT: Might want to read the name beforehand. Still, it lead to the next idea.
Which sparks an idea. We have Delta Fire Support and Delta Shield Support. Create 2 more Delta [blank] Support abilities, and spread them out among the four Delta Squads. We create synergy between the Deltas, along with strengthening the commandos. Because let's admit it, the Training Sergeant is too many points. Spread them out among the four, costs more points than the Sergeant, but better packages. And you can create custombility with the Commandos (Omega and the originals).
So you get really good with the four of them, but mixing and matching is a viable strategy.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:51 am
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Sithborg wrote:
I would change the CE to apply to commandos. Give the old ones and Omega some love.
I would also like to see the Rapport removed from the other characters and changed so that Boss makes them all cost less. Rapport that theoretically applies to themselves, and the same rapport on different characters is a bit of a headache.
And is there a particular reason why they shouldn't have Order 66? I think give them Order 66 and Delta Squad, as descriptors, would be fine.
Yes. That would be fine. Should it be for chars whose name contains "Republic Commando"?
Yes. It's all good to me.
Good suggestion. I wasn't aware you could just put a descriptor in there. I'll adjust the other pieces.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:58 am
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Oops, didn't see the name change. Last post still stands, though.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 3:36 pm
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Sithborg wrote:
Which sparks an idea. We have Delta Fire Support and Delta Shield Support. Create 2 more Delta [blank] Support abilities, and spread them out among the four Delta Squads. We create synergy between the Deltas, along with strengthening the commandos. Because let's admit it, the Training Sergeant is too many points. Spread them out among the four, costs more points than the Sergeant, but better packages. And you can create custombility with the Commandos (Omega and the originals).
So you get really good with the four of them, but mixing and matching is a viable strategy.
Do you mean Squads (bolded) or Characters? I think you mean characters; please correct me if I'm mistaken.
Here are the 2 Delta Support SAs that we have now.
Delta Fire Support (Each ally whose name contains Republic Commando gains Synchronized Fire [Allies with Order 66 who combine fire with this character grant +6 attack instead of +4])
Delta Shield Support (Each ally whose name contains Republic Commando gains Shields 2 [When this character takes damage, make 2 saves; each roll of 11 or higher reduces the damage dealt by 10])
If wonder if Delta Shield Support might be too strong to add to characters with 60/70 hp (rather than the originals' 30)? Maybe it needs to be Shields 1 rather than Shields 2.
Other options:
Advantageous Cover [+8 Defense from cover instead of +4]
Agile [This character can move 2 extra squares at the end of its turn]...this would represent their coordinated movements in the video game.
...Or, bouncing off of that, maybe another option is this:
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, a Republic Commando ally can immediately move 2 squares] This would mean that, in a squad of 4 of these guys, there would be 4 extra movements each round.
Other options using the Combined Fire mechanic (but honestly, most of these won't get used all that much, since nobody uses a 20+pt piece to CF). The most worthwhile one is probably Crack Shot:
Crack Shot [Whenever this character combines fire against a target within 6 squares, damage from the attack cannot be prevented or redirected]
Flanking Support [If this character combines fire against an enemy within 6 squares and the attack hits, that enemy has -4 Defense until the end of the round against allies that do not have Mounted Weapon.]
Improved Spotter [If this character combines fire against a target, the attacking character gets a +10 bonus to Damage against that target]
My initial suggestion is this:
Boss: Delta Movement Support (Coordinated Movement)...this would stack with his free attack CE (which might lose the 6-square movement?), and allow a piece to either attack (or replace attacks)and then move 2, or else move 2 and then attack (or replace attacks)
Fixer: Delta Shield Support (Shields 1)
Scorch: Delta Cover Support (Adv Cover)
Sev: Delta Fire Support (Synchronized Fire)
I still think the Synchronized Fire option would be nearly useless, so we could change out Sev's option. What do you guys think? Too complicated?
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 4:06 pm
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I was talking about the four Delta Squad guys.
Can't change Delta Shield Support. I've seen it played before, with the Omegas. It is okay, but they are really hurt with 30 pts hiding behind the scenes. Here, you would have the guy with it (ideally Boss, because he is Unique, so you can't have back up shields), out in the fight. And there are enough ways around it, that yes, it will be good, but plenty of ways to fight it.
And give it to Sev. It looks like he will be the main gun in most squads (like the original), so give him some possible support if he is used with the originals.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 4:12 pm
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Good to know that Shields 2 on these guys isn't overpowered. How about this:
Boss: Delta Shield Support (Shields 2)
Fixer: Delta Cover Support (Adv Cover)
Scorch: Delta Movement Support (Coordinated Movement)
Sev: Delta Fire Support (Synchronized Fire)
And for clarification, would each of these SAs would apply to the OTHER RC characters in the squad, or not? In other words, with the layout here, would Sev gain Synchronized Fire, and would Fixer gain Adv Cover?
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 4:55 pm
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Interesting. I missed the ally part. So they wouldn't benefit from their own ability.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:20 pm
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Sithborg wrote:
Interesting. I missed the ally part. So they wouldn't benefit from their own ability.
But if we reworded it to say "including this character" then they would benefit from it, right? I think they should. They worked as a team, so it wouldn't make sense if one of them couldn't do one of the team's things.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:48 pm
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I want to avoid changing WOTC rules that aren't variable.
The easiest option, is to give them the ability that they give out. Since they would lose it if they were defeated anyway, it works out fine, without trying to rework abilities or create something new and weird.
And looking at the Synchronized Fire they get, it as bad as you may think. Spaarti's can combine to grant +6 to an attack of one of the Commandos.
As for the other 2 abilities:
Delta Medical Support: Republic Commandos gain Heal 10 (20?). Based on the game, Avoid Defeat seems more fitting, but I figure Heal would keep Tim's blood pressure down. ;)
I do like Delta Movement Support (name needs little work, maybe?) that grants Coordinated Movement.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:21 pm
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Sithborg wrote:
I want to avoid changing WOTC rules that aren't variable.
The easiest option, is to give them the ability that they give out. Since they would lose it if they were defeated anyway, it works out fine, without trying to rework abilities or create something new and weird.
Good enough. I'm just starting to get concerned about space on the card.
Sithborg wrote:
And looking at the Synchronized Fire they get, it not as bad as you may think. Spaarti's can combine to grant +6 to an attack of one of the Commandos.
Okay, I hope you're right. It's not like Sev won't be useful anyway...a Twin Accurate shooter for 25pts is quite worthwhile already.
Sithborg wrote:
As for the other 2 abilities:
Delta Medical Support: Republic Commandos gain Heal 10 (20?). Based on the game, Avoid Defeat seems more fitting, but I figure Heal would keep Tim's blood pressure down. ;)
I do like Delta Movement Support (name needs little work, maybe?) that grants Coordinated Movement.
I think Heal 20 would be worthwhile. That would mean that Boss' CE could grant his guys an opportunity to heal each other if needed.
Delta Formation Support? Delta Position Support? Delta Tactics Support? It's all about them moving together as a single unit.
So then we've got this:
Boss: Delta Position Support (Coordinated Movement)...still needs a better name
Fixer: Delta Medical Support (Heal 20)
Scorch: Delta Shield Support (Shields 2)
Sev: Delta Fire Support (Synchronized Fire)
I'm liking the way it's looking here. Creative, fun, flavorful...and likely effective. Not bad for 100pts of your squad.
I'll start inputting these SAs into the appropriate character threads.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:28 pm
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Agreed on the space, but on the plus side, it won't have to be spelled out twice. Let the graphics guys figure out the best configuration.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:34 pm
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Quote:
Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement (At the end of this character's turn, a Republic Commando ally can immediately move 2 squares)
Delta Position Support (Each ally whose name contains Republic Commando gains Coordinated Movement)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (Characters whose name contains Republic Commando cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Republic Commando ally within 6 squares can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Added Delta Position Support (needs a better name) and Coordinated Movement.
Adjusted designations to include Delta Squad and Order 66.
Changed the version of Rapport so that it reduces the cost of others, rather than himself.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 10:07 pm
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Delta Formation Support?
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 11:04 pm
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Sithborg wrote:
Delta Formation Support?
Perfect.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 11:06 pm
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thereisnotry wrote:
Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement (At the end of this character's turn, a Republic Commando ally can immediately move 2 squares)
Delta Formation Support (Each ally whose name contains Republic Commando gains Coordinated Movement)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (Characters whose name contains Republic Commando cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Republic Commando ally within 6 squares can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Changed name to Delta Formation Support.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:56 pm
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:44 pm
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:48 am
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Quote:
Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement (At the end of this character's turn, a non-unique Republic Commando ally can immediately move 2 squares)
Delta Formation Support (Each non-unique ally whose name contains Republic Commando gains Coordinated Movement)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (Characters whose name contains Republic Commando cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Republic Commando ally within 6 squares can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Added "non-unique" to the wording of both Coordinated Movement and Delta Formation Support, as per PT results.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:18 pm
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set position 9.
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Post subject: Re: 10. BossPostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 10:02 am
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Quote:
Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement (At the end of this character's turn, an ally whose name contains Republic Commando - can immediately move 2 squares)
Delta Formation Support (Each ally whose name contains Republic Commando - gains Coordinated Movement)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (Characters whose name contains Republic Commando cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Republic Commando ally within 6 squares can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Changed wording on Delta Formaton Support and Coordinated Movement, as per Brad's suggestion in Boss' PT thread.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:26 am
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Question:
What exactly is the Delta Squad SA for? Does it do anything?
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:29 am
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Absolutely not. That is a level of rules minutae that needs to be avoided.
I get the thematic ideas behind, but I'm not seeing how leaving it as "Republic Commandos" is game breaking. If anything, it might see them see some use again.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:13 pm
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Warning - major ramble ahead ;)
swinefeld wrote:
Question:
What exactly is the Delta Squad SA for? Does it do anything?
Still curious about this. It's just pure flavor at this point unless I missed something.
Looking at the Omega guys' Rapport. It works off the Omega squad SA. What you have going here (RC's) ends up stacking so Omegas are -2.
That's not necessarily a bad thing, but these guys don't get that same help in return, so that encourages using Omega even more. Boss gets no reduction at all, even with Amidala (not a follower). Maybe he should just cost 1 less. I agree with Scott that it's better for him to give it out, it saves space on the other cards. Anyway, if you don't want the rapport stacking for Omega, that could be a place to use Delta Squad.
glossary? wrote:
Delta Squad
Any character whose name contains Delta Squad or who has the Delta Squad special ability. Non-Unique Republic Commando characters without Delta Squad whose names contain Boss, Fixer, Scorch or Sev are treated as if they had Delta Squad.
as the old RCs should be, so...
Quote:
Rapport [Delta Squad characters cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character]
That would also help streamline wordings of the new SAs that you're trying to keep off of Omega. As in:
Quote:
Delta Formation Support [Each Delta Squad ally gains Coordinated Movement]
As is, you've steered some stuff away from Omega, but if Yayax comes along later as non-Uniques and using the same type of naming scheme they will get them.
We can thank WotC for starting the mess, but probably made things worse by not using naming like "Omega Squad - Niner" and adding a Republic Commando SA to pick up other effects.
If you read this far, I owe you an Advil. ;) Feel free to ignore all this, I just needed to get it out of my head. It seems in danger of becoming the same kind of train wreck that Squad abilities turned into. Maybe my thoughts are just as screwed up. I dunno.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:15 pm
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It makes no sense why the various Commandos can't work together. As far as I am concerned, the Delta Squadron ability is pointless and isn't needed.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:34 pm
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Sithborg wrote:
It makes no sense why the various Commandos can't work together. As far as I am concerned, the Delta Squadron ability is pointless and isn't needed.
Yes, it should serve a purpose if it's going to be there, but outside of the kinds of things I layed out, not sure what that would be.
I really don't feel strongly one way or the other about who all is affected, but the inconsistency with the original Delta SAs does bug me as far as bookkeeping. It's hard enough to keep track of all the stuff on all the commandos' cards without adding Unique/Non-Unique distinctions between different Delta SAs.
Lastly, the Rapport could just be non-unique RCs to prevent stacking. I guess it's OK since Omega are all unique, just seems weird to me.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:50 pm
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I'm fine with everything working for everyone, really. I personally love the natural synergy that's working between all the RCs (of various squads). My only concern is that I'm afraid of making them overpowered. If you guys want to keep testing with the various abilities affecting everyone, then I'm fine with that too. I just don't want to create a broken mechanic.
Some things to keep in mind: The cost range and stat-blocks probably need to remain the same (or comparable) as the other new RC characters. And therefore, we need to be ready to make some adjustments in order to keep these pieces from becoming undercosted.
And yeah, let's go ahead and drop the Delta Squad identifier, if it's not going to be important. The more clutter we can remove from the stat cards of these guys, the better.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:23 pm
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Removed Delta Squad from all 4 PT blocks. (no other changes made yet)
Question: Why exactly is this Boss a Unique?
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 12:27 am
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swinefeld wrote:
Question: Why exactly is this Boss a Unique?
We didn't have enough room in the setlist for 3 more uniques; we had room for 1, hence Boss. The original RCs were non-unique, but the new Omega Squad RCs are unique, which kinda puts us in a bit of a wierd position.
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:56 am
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thereisnotry wrote:
swinefeld wrote:
Question: Why exactly is this Boss a Unique?
We didn't have enough room in the setlist for 3 more uniques; we had room for 1, hence Boss. The original RCs were non-unique, but the new Omega Squad RCs are unique, which kinda puts us in a bit of a wierd position.
Yeah, it is weird.
I assume the concern here, since this is a Gencon set, was the rarity distribution (for sealed). Uniqueness doesn't affect that. It's not as though non-Unique rares become 'chase' pieces in the context of virtual sets. (though I'm not encouraging the practice)
If he was n/u, could it get abusive with the CE and redundancy of Delta Formation? (easier to keep it going much farther into a game)
Does anyone have thoughts (for/against) on the rapport stacking for Omega?
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:09 pm
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swinefeld wrote:
thereisnotry wrote:
swinefeld wrote:
Question: Why exactly is this Boss a Unique?
We didn't have enough room in the setlist for 3 more uniques; we had room for 1, hence Boss. The original RCs were non-unique, but the new Omega Squad RCs are unique, which kinda puts us in a bit of a wierd position.
Yeah, it is weird.
I assume the concern here, since this is a Gencon set, was the rarity distribution (for sealed). Uniqueness doesn't affect that. It's not as though non-Unique rares become 'chase' pieces in the context of virtual sets. (though I'm not encouraging the practice)
If he was n/u, could it get abusive with the CE and redundancy of Delta Formation? (easier to keep it going much farther into a game)
Yes, I think the concern here is about rarity distribution for the sealed event. But honestly, I'd prefer it if all of the new RCs were unique. It's kind of dumb if you can have only 1 of every other new RC, but several of the new Sev/Scorch/Fixer, just because of a sealed event. Let Fixer/Sev/Scorch be unique on the card but UC on the setlist. Is there a good reason not to do this?
swinefeld wrote:
Does anyone have thoughts (for/against) on the rapport stacking for Omega?
This is a good question. I'm not in favor of it.
All 4 of the Omega Squad pieces have this:
Omega Squad (Counts as a character with Order 66 for the purposes of Commander Effects and cannot be in an Imperial squad)
And they have Rapport (This character costs 1 less when in the same squad as a character with Omega Squad)
Why can't we just do the same with Delta Squad?
Delta Squad (Counts as a character with Order 66 for the purposes of Commander Effects and cannot be in an Imperial squad)
It replaces "Order 66" on the card, and it also allows the Delta Formation Support (and other Delta) abilities to be restricted to the Delta Squad pieces, as originally intended. It also allows Boss' Rapport (-1 to Delta Squad costs) to NOT stack with the Omega Squad Rapport. Especially in light of the current shenanigans with stacking rapport on Snowtroopers, this is something to look closely at.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:18 pm
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Here is how it would look:
Quote:
Elite Republic Commando - Boss
Republic, 26pts
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
SAs:
Unique
Delta Squad (Counts as a character with Order 66 for the purposes of Commander Effects and cannot be in an Imperial squad)
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement (At the end of this character's turn, a Delta Squad ally can immediately move 2 squares)
Delta Formation Support (Each Delta Squad ally gains Coordinated Movement)
Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking)
Relay Orders (Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects)
Rapport (Delta Squad allies cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character)
Stealth (If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets)
CE:
At the end of this character's turn, one Delta Squad ally within 6 squares can either make an immediate attack or use a Special Ability that replaces attacks.
Changes to existing abilities are underlined.
Removed Order 66 (included in Delta Squad)
This prevents an unhealthy abuse of the Delta abilities, and it also simplifies things, I think. If we want to include the original RCs in it (and I think we should) then I'd suggest that the Glossary includes the original Boss, Sev, Fixer and Scorch as falling into the Delta Squad category.
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:48 pm
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I'm mainly looking for (relative) simplicity/consistency whichever way it goes.
I'm on the fence about the Delta Squad SA, which is fine since I'm not a designer anyway. ;) On the one hand it could tone down the new SAs, but on the other it creates a disconnect with the original abilities. More tests with it affecting all of them should probably decide which way it goes.
Without DS, the Rapport could just be non-Unique RCs. At these guys' price point, there are only so many you can fit in (especially if you want Rex), so don't know if Boss being a n/u would be a big problem as you lose another guy to run 2 of him.
Say it proves too strong with Omega getting everything - the Delta Guys actually went on to become Imperial Commandos, right? Then they should keep Order 66 as the originals have it. Just use DS as a plain identifier to limit the SAs.
If DS does get used, might tweak the glossary idea I posted above a bit to include the Training Sarge (assuming the new Shields Support guy will only give Shields 1 - not sure which it is supposed to be at this point) so he isn't left completely out of the picture.
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:17 pm
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Another reason to make Boss a n/u rare - his persona restriction will only affect this character (we're not changing WotC) so you can play Unique Boss with non-Unique Boss, which is kinda silly vs if they are both n/u.
I'm starting to wonder if the progress on the customs is too far along to adjust the set list a tad. Take Ommin's (R), replace with (UC). Make only 2 of these guys (R) and two other Rep (UC). Make the other 2 Deltas later.
Probably not.
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:50 pm
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updated
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Mobile Attack [Can move both before and after attacking]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
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LESHIPPY Online
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 11:39 am
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Playtested these stats
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Mobile Attack [Can move both before and after attacking]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 1 less when in the same squad as this character]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
[/quote]
Commandos setup first and setup in the lower right side with easy access to the middle.
Rebels outactivate the Commandos by a good bit so, the strategy in the beginning is to stay together and come in from the top and make the battle top vs bottom.
R1
R2 Tow Sev and lands next to Rex
Fixer Coordinated Movement (CM) Scorch
Fi CM Boss
Scorch CM Sev
Boss CM Scorch CE Scorch>Shatter Beam bottom room of Fuel Lift Room
Han has Accurate crap np shields will help
Han> Scorch h Shields s/s 20 Damge
Realizing that the rebels are stitting ducks if they try to continue the top down strategy luke moves down with knight speed and pilot speed 8 and ignoring lower cover and difficult terrain. Biggs follows
R2
Commandos win INT
Scorch >Biggs m/m Moves out of LOS Fixer CM
Rebs move 2 Dodona Retreats R2 locks right door of fuel lift room to block shots from Sev.
Cody>Han m/m
Fi Adv Door gm Control room door leftside Fixer CM
R7 Locks control room door right side
R2 Tos rex and unlock the door r7 just locked
Rex>Dutch h/h/h Dead
Bigs>Scorch h-Crit Shields s/s dead
Biggs>Cody H-Crit
Fixer>Bases Cody CM Boss
Boss moves >Biggs m CE Fixer heals Cody for 20
Klat Spins
Sev>Biggs m/m
Luke LSAssualt > Cody h/h/h/m
Han>sev m
Chewy> Sev with Mo H 30 Dam/h
Leia-Chewy>Sev H 30 Dead
Gambt Rebs
R3
Luke LS Assualt take AOO from Cody H Luke>Cody H Dead luke>Boss h/h
R2 Tx Rex base Luke
Rex> Luke h/h-crit ls def-f h/h
Chewy>Boss with Mo H dead >Fixer H
Fixer Luke m/m
Fi>Luke h ls def/f Dead
Leia - chwey > Fixer h
Biggs>fixer m/m
Han> Rex hit 40
R4
Commando INT
Fi Bases >Biggs h/h
Biggs>Fi h/h
Chewy > Fi h > Fixer m
R2 Tows Rex
Rex>Han hoping for a crit h/h/h/h
Han> Rex h Dead
Done
I like this guy. The only thing I can think of changing is the Rapport to -2. This would allow a little bit more activations. Yeah maybe only one ugy, but I think that would have helped this game.
Cordinated movement is great and having it go from guy to guy also really good. it should not go above two squares.
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:30 pm
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Started a conversation to talk about all 4 commandos in one spot
http://swmgamers.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=229&t=16642&p=172972#p172972
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 9. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 3:29 pm
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updated: Rapport 2
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Mobile Attack [Can move both before and after attacking]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 2 less when in the same squad as this character]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:08 pm
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Hi Mike,
I don't have your e-mail address on me, so sent this through bloomail. Apologies for the delay - I've been doing quite a few NR tests, so only just got to this.
(1) List the opponent (board name and actual name)
Ian (no board name)
(2) List the map
Starport
(3) Be sure it is a 60 minute timed game
Yup, finished just inside the hour.
(4) List the VSET 8 mini(s) used
Republic Commando Boss
(5) List the # of activations
Me – 12 (I tested with GOWK, Rex, Boss, Fi, Atin, R2, Mas, and filler)
Ian – 23 (same as Lou’s Regional winning snowtrooper swarm)
(6) List the total point cost
200
(8) Answer:
(a) How did the characters abilities interact with each other?
I really like him, although I need another game with him to get good at using the coordinated movement stuff. I was primarily using him as a shooter and for his cannon CE. The movement isn’t as crucial with Rex’s GMA and R2 already in the squad, but it seems like it would be pretty cool if you get good at it.
(b) Did you understand how the SA/CE interactions work after reading them just once?
It’s clearly worded, but I think I need another game with it to master it.
(c) Did the abilities on the character(s) make sense? Was anything out of place and/or missing?
I think he’s absolutely fine the way he is.
(d) Does the mini(s) work?
Yes.
(e) Is the cost accurate?
Yes.
(f) Any suggestions for it/them?
No.
(g) Analysis/Description of the game – Detailed accounting of the game
These swarm games aren’t very tactical to report, sorry!
We were trying Starport for the first time, so my positioning wasn’t great. I was trying to sneak into gambit, but left GOWK, a Spaarti, and a Mouse exposed. Ian swarmed in, and got lots of shots with the Czerka/Pellaeon on GOWK. He was unlucky not to take down GOWK first round, he only needed 3 shots to get through, but missed the vast majority of shots, needing 10s to hit, and GOWK survived until early in round 2.
My other pieces started picking off troopers reasonably well – I had enough shooters to make a game of it, and with GMA and Stealth, it was hard for Ian to pick them off, but eventually his numbers wore mine down, and he bought his Trooper commanders in to finish off Boss (last piece to go down), although he only had one Snow Trooper remaining.
I realized in game that I was playing slightly loosely from a rules perspective (I kept giving out GOWK’s CE out after he went down, I was using final shot on the cannon shots), but that just made the game closer. It’s not surprising, as I think Snow Troopers as a really strong Tier 1 squad, and I think Republic Commandos, even with GOWK and Rex, are more of a Tier 2 build.
So I think Boss is all good – good piece, who adds a good new option to Republic Commando squads, but I certainly wouldn’t worry that he’s going to cause any problems, and he’s nice and flavourful as well.
Thanks,
Graham
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 9:21 am
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PLAYTEST FORM/INFORMATION
MAP PLAYED: Asteroid Base
YOUR NAME: Obikenobi1 (Trevor Christensen)
FACTION: Republic
TOTAL NUMBER OF V-SET 8 MINIS PLAYED: 4
TOTAL COST: 200pt
REINFORCEMENTS (IF APPLICABLE):
V-SET 8 MINIS: Elite Republic Commando – Boss, Elite Republic Commando – Sev, Elite Republic Commando – Scorch, Elite Republic Commando – Fixer,
My squad was as follows:
--Elite Republic Commando's playtest
26 ERC - Boss
23 ERC - Sev
23 ERC - Fixer
23 ERC - Scorch
24 Republic Commando Niner
22 Republic Commando Fi
22 Republic Commando Darman
22 Republic Commando Atin
9 R2 Astromech
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2
(200pts, 11 activations)
OPPONENT’S NAME: Thereisnotry (Trevor Peyton)
FACTION: Republic
TOTAL NUMBER OF V-SET 8 MINIS PLAYED: 2
TOTAL COST: 200pts
REINFORCEMENTS (IF APPLICABLE):
V-SET 8 MINIS: Boba Fett, Assassin for Hire , Serra Keto
Trevor's squad:
--Cin Serra Boba—
50 Boba Fett, Assassin for Hire
48 Cin Drallig, Jedi Battlemaster
39 Quinlan Vos, Double Agent
30 Serra Keto
9 R2-D2, Astromech Droid
18 Rodian Brute x6
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2
(200pts. 13 activations)
(1) How did the characters abilities interact with each other?
The Coordinated Movement Ability was great for getting guys into position, especially Sev. The Shields 2 granted gave the squad good survivability. The Kolto Pack 20 was a bit excessive, but worked perfectly from keeping my guys from dieing.
(2) Did you understand how the Special Abilities/Commander Effect interactions work after reading them just once?
Yes
(3) Did the abilities on the character(s) make sense? Was anything out of place or missing?
Nothing on the ERC's was out of place. They worked really good together.
(4) Do the mini(s) work?
Yes. The squad was moving constantly and the Coordinated movement set up some really interesting options. The Kolot Pack 20 worked really well at keeping people alive. Shields 2 wasn't excessive as I usually only made one of the 2 saves most of the time.
(5) Is the cost accurate?
Yes. All the pieces are costed well.
(6) Any suggestions for it/them?
I think the Kolto Pack 20 should be changed to Kolto Pack 10. The range of 3 was really handy and I think it should be kept. The healing 20 was too good when combined with Shields 2. Thereisnotry had Sev down to 10 HP but couldn't kill him since I just healed him up to almost full HP with 2 kolto packs (one from Scorch and the other from Boss, who then used his CE to grant an attack to Sev). If we change it to Kolto Pack 10, I think it will be much more balanced and not to overwhelmingly difficult for the opponent to take the guys out.
(7) Analysis/description of the game:
I won map roll and choose Asteroid Base to give Thereisnotry the advantage since we were testing to see how well the squad did against a good melee squad. Serra Keto was really good in this game and took out one of my ERC's (I think it was Darman since I tried to use Gauntet Knife which Serra then used Riposte on). Boba Fett was good, but since he was only dealing 20 dmg, it was hard for him to kill my guys. I found the decoy ability to be annoying and so I focused on killing his rodian brutes to prevent him from getting out of my LOS for the rest of my ERC's so that once I killed his “swap” fodder, I could then kill Boba. I eventually killed Boba with Boss and I only lost 2 ERC's in the game and we finished the game in under 1 hour.
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Post subject: Re: 9. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 2:11 pm
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Are we ready to say this guy is good to go?
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Mobile Attack [Can move both before and after attacking]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 2 less when in the same squad as this character]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:08 pm
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Looks good to me.
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thereisnotry Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:37 pm
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Done
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:25 pm
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Rapport should be before Relay Orders
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Post subject: Re: 9. Elite Republic Commando - BossPostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:19 am
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updated
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique
Order 66
Double Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Mobile Attack [Can move both before and after attacking]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 2 less when in the same squad as this character]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 1:51 pm
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** Pre-card QC complete **
will probably need to do ; Stealth after Mobile Attack for space
tested at 6pt font
RM: RC Boss (CotF33) - used V7 #51 Ghes Orade
Quote:
9/45 Elite Republic Commando - Boss 26pts
(R) Republic
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Special Abilities
Unique. Order 66
Double Attack; Mobile Attack
Coordinated Movement [At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally may immediately move up to 2 squares]
Delta Formation Support [Each Republic Commando ally gains Coordinated Movement]
Rapport [Republic Commando characters cost 2 less when in the same squad as this character]
Relay Orders [Each allied commander can count distance from this character as well as from itself for the purpose of commander effects]
Stealth [If this character has cover, he does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets]
Commander Effect
At the end of this character's turn, 1 Republic Commando ally within 6 squares may make an immediate attack or use a special ability that replaces attacks.
"Identified my squad leader today. RC-1138 repeatedly tops squad in weapons and tactics testing and broke my arm in melee test."
―RC Batch Delta: Report: W Vau, Training Sergeant
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 11:12 am
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Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 11:25 am
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The stats were not updated.
Cost 26
HP: 70
Def: 17
Att: +10
Dmg: 20
Extra space at the beginning of the last line of the commander effect.
It looks like the Rapport affects himself. I assume it is not intended to. "Allied Republic Commando characters" would fix that and would not add another line to the card.
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 11:39 am
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There are 2 modes of Rapport. It either affects other characters, or affects the character with the SA based on the presence of some other character(s).
It would have to say (including this character) to affect him. It's fine.
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Sithborg Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 12:02 pm
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I have already ruled with the Omegas that Rapport cannot affect themselves.
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LESHIPPY Online
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 9:17 am
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Fixed
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 1:30 pm
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still a leading space in last line of CE
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LESHIPPY Online
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Mon May 12, 2014 7:44 am
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Fixed
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Mon May 12, 2014 8:06 am
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+1
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FlyingArrow Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Tue May 13, 2014 9:21 pm
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swinefeld wrote:
+1
+2
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Markedman247 Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed May 14, 2014 5:40 am
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FlyingArrow wrote:
swinefeld wrote:
+1
+2
+3
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swinefeld Offline
Post subject: Re: 10. Elite Republic Commando - Boss - Stats DonePostPosted: Wed May 14, 2014 6:57 am
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: approved :