At least 3 of the top 4 didn't have tempo control. What was Gerry playing?

I think Commandos are a deceptive build. If you lose to them, it likely looks like you had no chance because while all the synergy is there they are super-strong. But once one or two Deltas fall, the whole squad gets a lot weaker. The squad goes from powerhouse to barely hanging on very quickly.

This is the version I've been running, but depending on the expected meta I may try to fit in one of the Yayax:

--Republic Commando Multi-Cannons--
26 Elite Republic Commando - Boss
26 Republic Commando Niner
25 Elite Republic Commando - Fixer
25 Elite Republic Commando - Scorch
25 Elite Republic Commando - Sev
23 Clone Commander Bacara
38 Republic Commando - Boss x2
16 Republic Commando - Sev
8 Mas Amedda

(198pts. 10 activations)

A Durge on Speeder squad won the last major, and has popped up a few times in the Hutt Regional.

We're not using Set 9 yet, so the minor scissors options aren't available yet.

What were you running, Tim?

Rebel Commandos are certainly strong, but I'm not sure it's any better (worse?) than Zam Caught the Klat. Same issue: bunch of damage coming from guys you can't shoot back at. The RCs are more robust, but at least you can get adjacent and kill them without taking damage in return. I would think your NPE Extreme could do pretty well against RCs.

For the version I posted above it's hard to use cannon shots and GMA at the same time. You also lose an activation. Rex may be a better choice though.

Here's the squad I ran, with the main boosts/purposes of each piece listed behind their name

--Republic Commandos--
26 Elite Republic Commando - Boss (Coordinated Movement, Rapport, Extra Att CE)
24 Republic Commando Niner (+10dmg CE)
23 Elite Republic Commando - Fixer (Override, Synergy +4)
23 Elite Republic Commando - Scorch (Shatterbeam, Shields 2)
23 Elite Republic Commando - Sev (Twin Attack, Stable Footing)
23 Clone Commander Bacara (Superstealth CE)
19 Republic Commando Dev (Missiles 30)
19 Republic Commando Jind (Sentry...rarely used)
9 R2-D2, Astromech Droid
5 Rodian Diplomat
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2

(200pts. 12 activations)

Each piece contributed something valuable to the squad. Luke Cook's version didn't have Niner but it did have an extra Boss (the CotF version) and RC Atin (Final Shot) and Fi (Traps, Adv Door Gimmick), without Dev (Missiles). If he and I had played each other, I'm pretty sure I would've won, since I had 2 ways of removing his Stealth (Sentry and ItsATrap), while he had no way to remove my stealth. However, he was able to beat Jim once during Swiss; I seem to recall Jim commenting that the extra Boss made a big difference.

Really, I think there are several ways to build a solid RC squad. Squads with Fi (Traps) will have a much easier time vs tanks, while squads with Jind (Sentry) will be able to handle Klats and other SS much better. Squads with Rex will not suffer as much vs Force Sense, but squads with Bacara will destroy almost any shooter squad that can't remove stealth. Atin is a good choice, which I hadn't really considered too much; he basically gives you 2 solid finishers, rather than just one (Sev). Luke Cook even mentioned taking Yularen for Opportunist, though I'm not sure that would be worth it, since you have low activations.

TJ's comment about the squad losing effectiveness when it starts losing RCs is exactly right. Losing any of the ERCs is a huge setback to the synergy of the squad. Even losing one of the Yayax or Omega guys is bad, because that's less uses of Coordinated Movement, in addition to the contributions of that individual piece. I will say that the squad is a bit tricky to play, too. I was often having to double- and triple-plan my moves, just to be sure that I could coordinate my Coordinated Movement and other tricks effectively, without leaving myself hung out to dry. It's definitely not a squad for people who have a hard time finishing their games, because the Analysis-Paralysis will grind you to a halt, and you won't get any 3pt wins.

The question of Bacara's usefulness is a good one. The kind of competitive shooters we have is starting to shift. It used to be that all of the solid shooters were non-Accurate, but had the mobile-quad silliness (Cad/Rex/Dash), or else really high damage ceilings through other means (Jaq with ABM for 40s)...these guys were the go-to shooters for almost any squad. For that reason, Stealth has often been viewed from a designer standpoint as a reliable defensive ability that adds a lot to a piece's survivability, since the quad-cannons had a harder time with them. But now we've got Boba and Sev and NR Han, all of whom are very dangerous shooters with good damage output and Accurate Shot. They have a lower damage ceiling than the quad-cannons, but they can shoot guys with Stealth. So, since Accurate shooters are starting to be used again, the value of stealth has gone down, while the value of SuperStealth and Cloaked have increased. Right now, I think that Bacara is worth it, if only to give a fighting chance against those effective pieces with Accurate Shot...but he's pretty much 23 wasted points against Force Sense (ie, Jim's squad). And he's a decent 30dmg shooter (Cunning) too, most of the time. It's definitely worth trying a RC squad with Rex, though.


Here are my thoughts on the matchups that have been mentioned:

NPE Extreme (that's the single Lancer squad, right?): I don't think it's a big deal, because the Lancer can strafe everyone twice (in and then out again), but the RCs will be taking an average of 10dmg per hit and can easily use Kolto Pack to heal that damage while they advance...once they get far enough, it'll be fun. :) They also have sturdy door control (Shatterbeam and tough Override), so there would be no door shenanigans.

(speaking of which...) Double Lancer: Could be a problem, if enough damage can get through to drop a RC or two before both Lancers are gone. Shield saves will be key.

Shooters without a way to remove Stealth are hosed...just like Tim said.

Momentum: Any melee or in-your-face squad with a reliable way to close the gap stands a good chance. The question will be whether it can work through the Shields fast enough and survive long enough to kill enough of the RCs to turn the tide. Mace/GOWK could be a problem, if the RCs don't have Fi for Traps. The question, though, is whether Mace/GOWK can handle the rest of the meta. As an example, Talon Karrde is a severe--perhaps insurmountable--problem for jedi tank squads.

Morrigan: If she has a way to get in and get adjacent, she'll kill a RC every round (assuming a dmg boost). She likely won't be able to do it more than once, though, unless she outactivates and has a way to guarantee initiative. If she does, then that might be enough to swing the tide.

ABM: ABM will remove some of the squad's power (SS and damage boosts and cannon shots), but the OR still lack the solid accurate shooters that they'll need to attack the RCs. So at this point, I think that ABM by itself is not enough to carry the day for the OR against the RCs.

Daala: RCs are hard-to-kill pieces that shoot back; I think that matchup is at least 60/40 in favor of the RCs, unless there's some factor that I'm missing here. If Daala sends in 1 or 2 guys at at time (after outactivating), then Kolto Pack can heal, while the squad advances. If she sends them in large waves, then Daala had better hope that the shield saves are miserable, because each RC will take down 2 or more Imperial troopers each activation. And all of this is assuming that the Imperial troopers have a way to target the RCs (depending on the presence or absence of Bacara).


Anyway, I think it's clear that the RCs are contender in the meta; I just don't think they're as strong as they might appear. I'm still not sure how they could beat Jim's squad with any degree of reliability. Force Sense, coupled with the high damage output of solid shooters, means that RCs will be on their heels for most of that match.

Man, I had a big fat box with anything you needed 2 tables over the whole day. All you had to do was ask.

If it's any consolation - I don't think your squad fairs well vs RCs regardless. Maybe the quick death was less painful in the end.