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jen'ari
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 6:47:45 PM
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Please explain your thoughts on Luke Skywalker.

If you liked him why did you like him?

If you did not like him why did you not like him?

FlyingArrow
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 7:27:31 PM
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(Spoilers, obviously. Why are you on the Internet if you are worried about spoilers?)

I liked the meditation. I thought it was awesome. I didn't think he needed to die.

After immediately showing his power as a Jedi - doing something that I've never heard of anyone else doing (farsight, plus illusion on dozens to hundreds of individuals, plus telekinesis from across the galaxy) - then he dies. Showing he was great but only exactly this great because that was so hard it killed him literally. Pretty anticlimactic - way to go Luke - you "beat" Kylo in a powerful and surprising way but only kinda because you died in the process. Plotwise, it makes no sense other than to remove Luke from the story.

Unless there's (a lot) more to the story, Luke was pretty crappy person, which pretty much goes against the whole character built up in the OT. OT Luke jumped into the cockpit of a X-Wing to try to save the galaxy when he was offered an easy out... get off Yavin on the Millennium Falcon and run the other way with Han. OT Luke cared about his friends so much that he left Dagobah when he wasn't ready. He volunteered for the Endor mission and when he sensed he endangered it, he gave himself up to go face a more difficult challenge: his father. Consistently, Luke displays bravery... volunteering for difficult missions to save others.

In Episodes 7/8, he is in exile. He ran off after Kylo turned bad. His friends are in need. He doesn't care enough to do anything about it (or is too afraid), even after they come to get him. So is he a coward or uncaring or both? His meditation is a sort of redemption of that, but we aren't given enough to really explain how he goes from Brave OT Luke to Recluse Old Hard-Hearted Cowardly Luke. Kylo turned bad. Luke had a flash of temptation to kill him. But how does that change him into a coward or make him stop caring about his friends?

Maybe we'll get a decent explanation, but it really feels like, "Um. Let's write a Han Solo story in Episode 7. Luke is... I dunno.. in exile? Yeah, we'll deal with that in episode 8. Sure, sounds good."
General_Grievous
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 8:57:02 PM
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Massive spoilers:





Luke made the Force great again! Hahaha. I really liked him but super sad that he died.
Caedus
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 9:15:37 PM
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General_Grievous wrote:
Massive spoilers:





Luke made the Force great again! Hahaha. I really liked him but super sad that he died.


They had to have him die in order to start the new rivalry. The Grandson of Anakin Skywalker and the Granddaughter of Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Obviously we know who Ben Solo is but it is possible that Rey is the Grandchild of Obi-Wan and Duchess Satine. (Let the Hate begin) but Obi-Wan's voice did call out to her.

Also, I hope that we get to find out that Maz Kanata is a Guardian of the Whills.

Bare with me. She speaks passionately about the Force, She can feel the Force and she "finds" a lightsaber and guides Rey to the Force. Well, a guy can hope.
CorellianComedian
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 9:42:18 PM
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Short version: I seem to be in the minority, but I was mostly okay with Luke's character development. It is a much different Luke than in the Original Trilogy, but at the same time, I think a guy with that much heart is also open to being wounded pretty deeply.

I hate that they killed him. That was very poorly done. I don't think they built up to it properly. When Yoda went, it was kinda surprising... but not really. Once he started dying, it was clear what was going on. When Luke died, yeah, there was emotional music, and he did look worn out from his Illusion use, but he seemed like he had recovered just fine. So I was not anticipating it at all until his cloak fell.

Happening right at the very, very end of the movie like that was also a poor choice. It was just kind of like "Oh yeah, Luke died. Bummer. Let's show Rey and Leia being sad for 5 seconds, and then end the movie." They didn't give enough time for Rey and Leia to legitimately react, so showing them react at all felt rushed - they should have given more time, or if nothing else just ended the movie right with Luke's death.

I guess, the point of the movie was that there's still hope even after all these things they were trusting in failed them - Poe was relying on the Resistance having a cruiser; Rey was relying on Luke training her. Both failed (sort of). That, I think, is an important point for a movie to make - we don't always need what we think we need to move forward. So on that note, I guess I'm okay with Luke dying, and in a sense I'm satisfied that Kylo didn't get to kill him. There's been so much Mary Sue (and Gary Stu) action in the new trilogy already, that Kylo killing Luke would be pretty lame - I am never a fan of the "Let's establish our enterprising young villain by letting him kill the most powerful good guy we have" cliche. It never feels right, and is followed by a decade of fans debating whether or not said villain had gained enough power or said hero had sat in exile long enough for that the villain to win.

But along those lines, Luke shouldn't have had the epic showdown with Kylo. For me, that whole scene of Luke vs. Kylo set up Luke as a force to be reckoned with who would feature prominently in the next movie even though he was not the main hero (and would probably have to be killed off). Luke should have either died peacefully without the big showdown, died peacefully close to the beginning of Episode 9 (like Yoda in RotJ), or else had his epic Projection showdown and then died in an actual fight against overwhelming odds some time in Episode 9.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Sunday, December 24, 2017 9:57:09 PM
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Caedus wrote:
General_Grievous wrote:
Massive spoilers:





Luke made the Force great again! Hahaha. I really liked him but super sad that he died.


They had to have him die in order to start the new rivalry. The Grandson of Anakin Skywalker and the Granddaughter of Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Obviously we know who Ben Solo is but it is possible that Rey is the Grandchild of Obi-Wan and Duchess Satine. (Let the Hate begin) but Obi-Wan's voice did call out to her.

Also, I hope that we get to find out that Maz Kanata is a Guardian of the Whills.

Bare with me. She speaks passionately about the Force, She can feel the Force and she "finds" a lightsaber and guides Rey to the Force. Well, a guy can hope.


That would be pretty awesome.
spryguy1981
Posted: Monday, December 25, 2017 6:40:15 AM
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I still contend Rey is really the daughter of Ezra Bridger and Sabine Wren! lol

I felt like Luke dying was sort of a rotten end to his storyline. Yes he did have an epic use of the Force, but then Darth Vectivus did that stuff all the time and didn't die after one use. I think Disney in a way is thumbing their nose at the old fans. Here's Han he's dead, here's Luke, he's dead, next will be Leia, R2, 3P0, and Chewie so that they can say this is their show and old ways are dead. Sort of like the Jedi manuscripts.

Doesn't mean I hated the movie, but it just looks like this is the direction Disney is going. I could understand dead Leia as Carrie Fisher is gone, but dead Luke, c'mon.

Overall though, I don't consider this to be one of my favorite movies by any means. It was decent, but it sort of ranks towards the bottom for me. Force Awakens I felt was a better movie. I may be in the minority, but hey, I'm used to that.

1. Ep 6
2. Ep 5
3. Ep 4
4. R1
5. Ep 3
6. Ep 7
7-8. Ep 2 and Ep 8 (not sure which I like more)
9. Ep 1
shmi15
Posted: Monday, December 25, 2017 8:57:07 AM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Caedus wrote:
General_Grievous wrote:
Massive spoilers:





Luke made the Force great again! Hahaha. I really liked him but super sad that he died.


They had to have him die in order to start the new rivalry. The Grandson of Anakin Skywalker and the Granddaughter of Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Obviously we know who Ben Solo is but it is possible that Rey is the Grandchild of Obi-Wan and Duchess Satine. (Let the Hate begin) but Obi-Wan's voice did call out to her.

Also, I hope that we get to find out that Maz Kanata is a Guardian of the Whills.

Bare with me. She speaks passionately about the Force, She can feel the Force and she "finds" a lightsaber and guides Rey to the Force. Well, a guy can hope.


That would be pretty awesome.




I don't want Obi-Wan to of had a child in anyway :( He was the purest form of a Jedi the Universe has to offer. Not for plot, not for character build, just for my selfish self :( lol. I would not hart eit, as Obi-Wan became my favorite Jedi, and his legacy going on would be neat. I just think he is to much of the "poster boy" for the Jedi. No hate tho.

I think maybe her being the daughter of Sabine and Ezra would be fantastic for the storyline, so I would agree with Spry on that one. It would make sense why they cut the series off before the movie came out, just to find out they go to end up on Jakku or something, lol.

Back to the topic.... I think Luke dying was from exertion... I think he was more "At one with the Force" I think he finally found peace, and was willing to go to the great beyond, and I will almost bet he appears as a Force Spirit in the enxt movie somewhere...


Maz as a Guardian would be AWESOME
jen'ari
Posted: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 2:04:54 PM
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I rewatched The Last Jedi for the $5 matinee.

I love Luke and i can see him being in that position and mind set very easily. I can't wait for more backstory. I think the whole map thing was his way of having one last tie with the world. But he left his X-Wing submerged and even took parts off of it so I think he was there to stay after he did that.

But he I like that he was craggy and ready for things to move on. He had so much bitter and raw emotion that eve he did not understand. The "incomplete" master fits Luke very well. Even in the EU he was not a great master, just powerful.
shmi15
Posted: Wednesday, December 27, 2017 8:10:54 AM
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Mark Hammil officially recants his statements about The Last Jedi, and is now saying it was childish of him to say any of the things he did... And is he is now on board with Rian Johnsons vision of Luke.
jen'ari
Posted: Wednesday, December 27, 2017 9:04:00 AM
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shmi15 wrote:
Mark Hammil officially recants his statements about The Last Jedi, and is now saying it was childish of him to say any of the things he did... And is he is now on board with Rian Johnsons vision of Luke.


Damage is done on that and Mark Hamill the person has been soured for me for his whiny self, if I am being honest.

Luke lives on either way.
shmi15
Posted: Wednesday, December 27, 2017 11:09:53 AM
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jen'ari wrote:
shmi15 wrote:
Mark Hammil officially recants his statements about The Last Jedi, and is now saying it was childish of him to say any of the things he did... And is he is now on board with Rian Johnsons vision of Luke.


Damage is done on that and Mark Hamill the person has been soured for me for his whiny self, if I am being honest.

Luke lives on either way.



Its funny, you should see what he blames for his initial reaction! You'll never believe it! lol
jen'ari
Posted: Wednesday, December 27, 2017 11:38:09 AM
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You should link me to it
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