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Is the game in some sort of transitional state? Options
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 5:37:36 AM
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I have somewhat fallen out of SWM. Just not anyone around me who plays anymore, and i've found some new friends into X-Wing. Yet I still lurk here from time to time.

Seems like the majority of the posts here are for errata, requesting modifications to more pieces, and discussing the problems with melee and how to fix them, phasing out older v-sets, etc. Now, the game has had people demanding changes since I started playing in A&E, but this feels different somehow, maybe the arguments feel more justified?

I am wondering how people feel about the game right now. Is it about to undergo some sort of major change? Or am i miss-perceiving the current situation due to my absence from the scene?
AdmiralMotti89
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 5:51:16 AM
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My attitude toward the game is probably not a common one, for me I donate for each v-set and enjoy looking at the new cards and creative abilities and occasionally seeing a design that may have incorporated elements from some of my designs in the past. I play once or twice a year at family gatherings. I am pretty much a collector now, buying on ebay, keeping the pieces I want, and selling or trading the rest.

Because these are my motivations, I am not personally too concerned about the meta. Maybe poggle bombs are getting out of hand, but I don't play enough (or well enough) for them to be a real issue for me.

However, I do get that if it is an issue for other people, that may cause the community to shrink, shrinking the creative pool, the donation pool, the trading pool, etc. As the quality of those shrinks, so does interest, and you get a bit of a snowball.

I don't really know if we are heading toward a major change. I have no problem with temporary bans of pieces. I respect the challenge that designers face; that everyone wants to create pieces but fewer are super motivated to work to test them out.

I think the best thing is already being done: Designers listening to what people don't like about the current game and designing with those issues in mind. It's a bummer things like the CDO and Heroic Sacrifice got through and don't look fixable with the next round of pieces (one errata, one errata upcoming), but a few bad apples in my mind have not spoiled the whole barrel.
Echo24
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 5:51:21 AM
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It's a combination of things, including but not limited to:

-The game shifted towards shooters instead of melee attackers (ie, Jedi), which people have disliked. A particular sticking point in the past couple of months was the Commando Droid Officer released at GenCon last year, which has now been banned.

-The community has gotten smaller (for a whole big variety of things outside the scope of this thread), but the percentage of people who demand change hasn't really gone down. This makes the demands sound louder.


I will say that the design team is spending quite a bit of time and effort talking about making a "major change" and just how major that might be. It's important that we get it right, though, and don't just push through the first "fixes" we think of, or we're likely to be back in the same boat. Just yesterday I was reading about the Star Wars CCG and how last summer they did a complete reset of ALL of their v-sets to date. That isn't where we are going, but there were some interesting thoughts from over there. I think this will likely be discussed on the SHNN tonight if you're interested in listening.
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 7:31:20 AM
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Good feedback guys. I appreciate it. Also, I just donated for V-Set 10 (I was on the fence, but in the end, tradition and support for a game and community that's kept my brains sane for so many years won me over). Do you know if there was a deadline for these v-10 donations?
Echo24
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 7:36:35 AM
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I'm not directly in charge of the donations/printing, but as far as I know, we always print enough sets to be sure that people who don't get to donate early still get a set, so there isn't really a deadline. If you donated, you'll get a set. Smile
Jedicartographer
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 8:08:58 AM
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My own perspective, from my own sales and over all engagement from the Star Wars Miniatures Community, and it's only my perspective, the game is probably not in transition as much as it's run it's course.

The population of players is in decline. The vast majority of my regular customers for map packs didn't pick up a copy of the latest map pack. Most people using my maps now are people who play different RPGS. Overall interest in the latest map pack was at an all time low.

I kind of lurk these forums to gauge what the big issues are and what the latest buzz is, and I'll be honest with you, most of it is over my head. While I'm extremely impressed and even a bit proud of the fact that they've continued the game through V-sets, my own interest in V-sets has faded as well. So I'm not sure what most the big game play issues are.

My own interest in the game itself has diminished for several reasons:

1. PRIMARILY, I miss the social aspect of all of it. Nothing attracts a crowd like a crowd, nothing empties a room like an empty room.

2. I miss opening new boosters, and I don't have time to modifiy minis, and My brain won't allow me to reconcile proxy pieces. I miss prize support, and actual news, and real teasers. I'm the average consumer and my attention is only held for so long.

3. As I stated earlier, I love how much went into the V-sets. but from a casual player's viewpoint, and from what people have said too me, some of the rules seem over the top, convoluted, and there is so much stuff on the cards, its very difficult to read them. And I've never been a fan of the majority of the Expanded Universe, so my excitement for the characters has never been at any kind of level that kept me engaged.

4. There may be about 4 or 5 people that even actually care that I'm making maps. I've personally reached out several times to this community, and old guys from back in the day that played and were active in the forums, and nobody is buying the maps here anymore, and nobody wants to really get excited about it anymore. Honestly the all the bickering that was going on a couple weeks ago that eclipsed every single one of my updates really knocked all the remaining wind out of my sails for this game, and the people involved with it, and making anymore maps for SWM.


THIS IS ALL JUST MY FEELINGS, PLEASE DON'T GET WOUND UP, OR ASK FOR SUPPORTING ARGUMENTS OR EXAMPLES




jak
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 3:06:51 PM
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+1 you make a lot of good points.
I too feel the glorious ride will soon be over.
nobody is happy with all the aspects of the game, we all have things we'd like to see changed.
sooner or later we'll get the straw that breaks our back, and the game will end for us.
I play less now than I ever have(need an opponent), and the more things change, the more I get annoyed.
jen'ari
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 4:35:06 PM
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jak wrote:

I play less now than I ever have(need an opponent), and the more things change, the more I get annoyed.


Do you play vassal?
I really feel that Vassal is a main part of the future of SWM
urbanjedi
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 5:08:47 PM
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adamb0nd wrote:
Good feedback guys. I appreciate it. Also, I just donated for V-Set 10 (I was on the fence, but in the end, tradition and support for a game and community that's kept my brains sane for so many years won me over). Do you know if there was a deadline for these v-10 donations?


No, no deadline. The stuff has been sent to the printer, but we always end up with some extras for latecomers and such like yourself.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 5:09:43 PM
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vassal should be the future of SWM especially with the New Zealand group getting larger and larger. but i think for vassal to work there also needs to be like some kind of group chat/meeting thing where the people watching can interact as well, make it more like a regional where you get that interaction with multiple people and stuff. only so far typing can go on that level.
billiv15
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 6:11:47 PM
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You can use skype with vassal. Works great, multiple people on the call, and it's free.
General_Grievous
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 7:00:03 PM
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It still lives in the north! Haha we are big players and enjoy the game in different aspects. Also Matt you will always have a customer in me man. SWM till I die haha
kezzamachine
Posted: Thursday, May 28, 2015 7:34:15 PM
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Location: Lower the Hutt, New Zealand
The game is still fairly strong in NZ. We've had some people significantly lessen their involvement over the last year, but we've also had new players join, so we're about even numbers-wise. The biggest issue we're dealing with is probably the sheer number of options and people perhaps finding themselves less motivated to sift through them all to find squads they want to run. (I'm working on solutions to that and that is also balanced by other players that still love the wide variety and the new stuff we get!)

One big piece of the puzzle is that we are looking forward to our fourth NZ Championships in July and we're actually looking at this one being our biggest yet. More news when it come to hand...
Jonnyb815
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 1:34:57 AM
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billiv15 wrote:
You can use skype with vassal. Works great, multiple people on the call, and it's free.

Yes but trying to find the mod for a new player is so hard. Again I don't see the point in trying to grow this game or even play it if its not easy to find stuff. I understand Les is working on a new site and some of these points will be addressed but the game is on a limited life and every day matters.

I don't play on Vassal because I have no clue were to find the new mods and PDFs so I can look over the figures easier for me than Bloomilk.

Greybird
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 4:38:34 AM
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Jedicartographer wrote:

4. There may be about 4 or 5 people that even actually care that I'm making maps. I've personally reached out several times to this community, and old guys from back in the day that played and were active in the forums, and nobody is buying the maps here anymore, and nobody wants to really get excited about it anymore.


Hi, JC! Longtime fan of your maps here, both for the game as well as for RPG'ing, although I have not posted on these forums in a terribly awful long while - not a whole lot of reason to lurk here anymore except out of occasional curiosity about your new maps. Are you only selling new maps now on your maps of mastery website, or is there still a chance they may show up at Miniature Market at some point, which is where I've generally bought all of them?
jak
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 5:15:03 AM
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I like the human interaction, face to face, while playing the game.
playing on vassel would be like playing a regular video game, vs the computer.
Jedicartographer
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 5:21:16 AM
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General_Grievous wrote:
It still lives in the north! Haha we are big players and enjoy the game in different aspects. Also Matt you will always have a customer in me man. SWM till I die haha


You're definitely one of the 4 or 5 people I was referring to :-) But you don't count as I consider you a buddy more than a customer!! Honestly as much money as you've thrown at me the past few years, you're more of a sugar daddy!
Jedicartographer
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 5:24:16 AM
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Greybird wrote:
Jedicartographer wrote:

4. There may be about 4 or 5 people that even actually care that I'm making maps. I've personally reached out several times to this community, and old guys from back in the day that played and were active in the forums, and nobody is buying the maps here anymore, and nobody wants to really get excited about it anymore.


Hi, JC! Longtime fan of your maps here, both for the game as well as for RPG'ing, although I have not posted on these forums in a terribly awful long while - not a whole lot of reason to lurk here anymore except out of occasional curiosity about your new maps. Are you only selling new maps now on your maps of mastery website, or is there still a chance they may show up at Miniature Market at some point, which is where I've generally bought all of them?


Wrong Map Maker. :-) That's Chris West you're referring to. You've probably bought mostly everything from me too if you went through miniature market, but I do have a website you can check out though, and check to make sure! You probably don't have Map Pack 6 yet. it's coming out in a couple weeks. I won't be going through miniature market this time, so get it directly from me! Thanks!

FPMMAPS.COM

Greybird
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 5:38:07 AM
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Jedicartographer wrote:
Greybird wrote:
Jedicartographer wrote:

4. There may be about 4 or 5 people that even actually care that I'm making maps. I've personally reached out several times to this community, and old guys from back in the day that played and were active in the forums, and nobody is buying the maps here anymore, and nobody wants to really get excited about it anymore.


Hi, JC! Longtime fan of your maps here, both for the game as well as for RPG'ing, although I have not posted on these forums in a terribly awful long while - not a whole lot of reason to lurk here anymore except out of occasional curiosity about your new maps. Are you only selling new maps now on your maps of mastery website, or is there still a chance they may show up at Miniature Market at some point, which is where I've generally bought all of them?


Wrong Map Maker. :-) That's Chris West you're referring to. You've probably bought mostly everything from me too if you went through miniature market, but I do have a website you can check out though, and check to make sure! You probably don't have Map Pack 6 yet. it's coming out in a couple weeks. I won't be going through miniature market this time, so get it directly from me! Thanks!

FPMMAPS.COM



Oops! Sorry! Thanks for the heads up! I'll have to take a look! (I've been out of touch with SWM things online for such a long while.)
Mando
Posted: Friday, May 29, 2015 5:49:40 AM
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Jedicartographer wrote:

4. There may be about 4 or 5 people that even actually care that I'm making maps. I've personally reached out several times to this community, and old guys from back in the day that played and were active in the forums, and nobody is buying the maps here anymore, and nobody wants to really get excited about it anymore. Honestly the all the bickering that was going on a couple weeks ago that eclipsed every single one of my updates really knocked all the remaining wind out of my sails for this game, and the people involved with it, and making anymore maps for SWM.



Well you can make that 5 or 6 people now that actually care that you are making maps. In the past I wasn't much in the loop for buying maps as I had bought a huge collection of maps from a retired swm player back about 4 years ago. But I have a very good star wars rpg group that I've been GM'ing for 4 years now, and I am excited to play on new maps. I backed the Map pack 6 on kickstarter (first time using that website) and I am looking forward to map pack 7! I think you might have more supporters for your maps than you might know, but just thought you'd like to know you got one more gamer that cares about what you make than you previously thought. I'll definitely be keeping an eye out for future maps to purchase from you from now on. ThumpUp
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