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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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Juhani 25pts Hit Points: 80 Defense: 17 Attack: 9 Damage: 20 Special Abilities Unique Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Double Attack (On her turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Deadly Attack (Scores a critical hit on an attack roll of natural 19 or 20) Lightsaber Duelist (+4 Defense when attacked by an adjacent enemy with a Force rating) Stealth (If this character has cover, she does not count as the nearest enemy for an attacker farther than 6 squares when choosing targets) Vicious Attack (Triple damage instead of double on a critical hit)
Force Powers Force 3 Force Cloak (Force 2, replaces turn: For the rest of the skirmish, this character gains Cloaked) Lightsaber Block (Force 1: When hit by a melee attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11) Sith Rage (Force 1: +10 Damage on all attacks this turn)
Vs Jedi Watchman 24pts Hit Points: 70 Defense: 17 Attack: 9 Damage: 20 Special Abilities Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Cloaked (If this character has cover, he cannot be targeted by nonadjacent enemies.) Lightsaber Duelist (+4 Defense when attacked by an adjacent enemy with a Force rating)
Force Powers Force 2 Lightsaber Block (Force 1: When hit by a melee attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11)
I personally would just use Juhani every time and cant see why anyone else would do different who would you use. I know everyone does not have Juhani and the she is very rare vs common but the poll is about the power difference for 1pt.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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Well, non-uniques tend to get more CEs. The Watchman is also eligible for the OR Captain's CE whereas Juhani is not. He also doesn't have to spend FPs to become Cloaked. Those can be saved for re-rolls or LS Block. It's the fact that you can run multiple Watchman versus just one Juhani.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/9/2009 Posts: 936 Location: Southern Illinois
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Personally I like the free cloak on the first turn. The watchman is also not unique which these days makes a big deal when facing bounty hunters. The nonunique part also means you can use more than one in your squad.
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Rank: Grand Master Yoda Groups: Member
Joined: 9/13/2008 Posts: 508
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Well the watchman does have several advantages:
1) Non-Unique. You can use 1 or 10 of them, doesn't matter.
2) Doesn't have to spend force to Cloak, already is. Juhani loses all but her last FP to Cloak and it costs her a whole activation to do it, meaning she is useless the rest of that turn. Really hurts her in swap squads if you want to try to get her in the action early.
3) Can't have Bounty Hunter used on her. Cad Bane needs anything but 1s to kill Juhani in one activation. The Watchman will have at least 10 HP at the end of Cad's activation odds are.
4) Much easier to collect.
5) Benefits from Talz Chieftain, Old Republic Captain, Weequay Leader, and other CEs Juhani can't.
6) Has a better sculpt.
I'm sure I missed something....
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 8/24/2008 Posts: 812 Location: Parkville, MD
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Use both?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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You both make some good points but for just 1 more point and you get all of those extras.
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Rank: Grand Master Yoda Groups: Member
Joined: 9/13/2008 Posts: 508
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Seems I was a minute late lol....
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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Eroschilles wrote:Use both? Not a bad idea Im just saying 1 more pt and she is a follower
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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saeseetiin wrote:You both make some good points but for just 1 more point and you get all of those extras. To be frank, it's hard to build around the OR. There are very few CEs that work for both pieces. So Juhani is probably best served in other factions (not that she is horrible in the OR). I love Deadly and Vicious Attack, but they are situational. They aren't guarantees. If they happen, great. But I wouldn't plan around a crit happening.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 8/24/2008 Posts: 812 Location: Parkville, MD
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saeseetiin wrote:Eroschilles wrote:Use both? Not a bad idea Im just saying 1 more pt and she is a follower I think the main reason why Juhani is only a point more and has so much more is because she is unique and you can only use one. I think she is overall the better choice if it came between the two for an OR squad. But using both would certainly be a good idea methinks.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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Tirade wrote:saeseetiin wrote:You both make some good points but for just 1 more point and you get all of those extras. To be frank, it's hard to build around the OR. There are very few CEs that work for both pieces. So Juhani is probably best served in other factions (not that she is horrible in the OR). I love Deadly and Vicious Attack, but they are situational. They aren't guarantees. If they happen, great. But I wouldn't plan around a crit happening. But if I am lucky enough to use sith rage roll a 19 or 20 that would be 70 damage and another attack comming all that for 1 pt.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator, Rules Guy
Joined: 8/24/2008 Posts: 5,201
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Cloaked off the bat and an Old Republic follower are the benefits. Seriously, the OR Captain will give the Watchmen both a better Atk and Def. And is it better to block once or twice. About the only thing Juhani has going for her is Sith Rage, since Deadly/Vicious is still far too random to be much of a factor in such decisions.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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saeseetiin wrote:Tirade wrote:saeseetiin wrote:You both make some good points but for just 1 more point and you get all of those extras. To be frank, it's hard to build around the OR. There are very few CEs that work for both pieces. So Juhani is probably best served in other factions (not that she is horrible in the OR). I love Deadly and Vicious Attack, but they are situational. They aren't guarantees. If they happen, great. But I wouldn't plan around a crit happening. But if I am lucky enough to use sith rage roll a 19 or 20 that would be 70 damage and another attack comming all that for 1 pt. That's great if you can pull that off. I'm just saying I wouldn't plan on that happening. If it does, it's a bonus. I'm not factoring that into my decision to pick Juhani over the Watchman. BTW, I like Juhani more on a consistent basis.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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And I did originally write this.
I know everyone does not have Juhani and the she is very rare vs common but the poll is about the power difference for 1pt.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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Sithborg wrote:Cloaked off the bat and an Old Republic follower are the benefits. Seriously, the OR Captain will give the Watchmen both a better Atk and Def. And is it better to block once or twice. About the only thing Juhani has going for her is Sith Rage, since Deadly/Vicious is still far too random to be much of a factor in such decisions. Bingo. You can actually take advantage of the Captain's Squad Assault since the Watchman is non-unique. In a 200 squad, I'd actually consider running 4 with a Captain and some mice.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator, Rules Guy
Joined: 8/24/2008 Posts: 5,201
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saeseetiin wrote:And I did originally write this.
I know everyone does not have Juhani and the she is very rare vs common but the poll is about the power difference for 1pt. You are looking at a Unique vs a Generic. Of course there is going to be a slight difference, since Unique is generally considered a drawback. And again, NOT having to waste 2 FPs is much, much better than Stealth with the option to to use 2/3 of your FPs. Juhani may have better damage output (slightly, because you really aren't using Sith Rage that much), but the Watchmen is better defensively with built in Cloaked. Heck, they will last a lot longer than Battlemasters.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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Tirade wrote:Sithborg wrote:Cloaked off the bat and an Old Republic follower are the benefits. Seriously, the OR Captain will give the Watchmen both a better Atk and Def. And is it better to block once or twice. About the only thing Juhani has going for her is Sith Rage, since Deadly/Vicious is still far too random to be much of a factor in such decisions. Bingo. You can actually take advantage of the Captain's Squad Assault since the Watchman is non-unique. In a 200 squad, I'd actually consider running 4 with a Captain and some mice. So you based you decision on 1 commander and that drives cost up.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/8/2009 Posts: 585 Location: New York City
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Not every game will you need cloak off the bat plus Juhani has stealth.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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saeseetiin wrote:Tirade wrote:Sithborg wrote:Cloaked off the bat and an Old Republic follower are the benefits. Seriously, the OR Captain will give the Watchmen both a better Atk and Def. And is it better to block once or twice. About the only thing Juhani has going for her is Sith Rage, since Deadly/Vicious is still far too random to be much of a factor in such decisions. Bingo. You can actually take advantage of the Captain's Squad Assault since the Watchman is non-unique. In a 200 squad, I'd actually consider running 4 with a Captain and some mice. So you based you decision on 1 commander and that drives cost up. Generally, non-uniques have more advantages in this game (you can run multiples, immune to Bounty Hunter, there are specific CEs for non-uniques). I'm sure Juhani was discounted (cost-wise) because she is a Unique.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/25/2008 Posts: 536 Location: Tracy, CA
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saeseetiin wrote:Not every game will you need cloak off the bat plus Juhani has stealth. True. But if I see an accurate shooter like Boba on the other side, you can bet Cloak will be considered. I do like that Juhani also has Stealth. That means she can gain GMA via the TBSV and the BBSV. Those are also 2 very competent commanders.
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