See, every time I try to explain this point, someone comes out with the ridiculous comparison. That isn't what I was saying. Look at the conversation thus far. The comments would lead someone to say that the best Rebel squad, would always beat the best of another faction. That just isn't true, and it isn't even true from a percentage standpoint either. A good player with OR or Vong, will beat a decent player with Rebels more than 50% of the time.

When we have this discussion, people always want to use the "well assuming players of equal strength" argument and that's all well and good, but you have to think of the reality here. This almost never happens, and it even more rarely happens with two really good players. The results of two equal players of low skill do not turn out the same as that of two top level competitive players. This almost always leads people to believe non-melee is vastly superior to melee figures for example, because at this level of the game, that's pretty much true. At the higher levels, it changes dramatically and we have very different results.

So if our only way to make an argument that one faction is stronger than another is based on the assumption that the players are equal, and that they are each top level competitive, well then we have already constricted our comments and results down to a level which is meaningless to anyone else in the forum interested in reading it.

Even further, most of you don't recognize that even considering top level squads in the hands of top level players against others are only percentage points better than another option.
No one played Vong. If the map list was less open, and/or the champ was played at 200, Vong very easily could have competed. Further, you also have to take into account slow play, which right now, severely hampers many of the existing Vong squads. But if you step away from Gencon, I won a couple of tournaments with Vong last year, one with Jonnyb and MtMagus also playing in it. Nickname wins at his local store all the time with Vong. Dean has won tournaments with OR. I've beaten Rebels, NR, Imperials and Republic with OR on Vassal multiple times. And finally, at the championship level, the players will choose the squads that they believe give them the best advantage, even when it's tiny or just a perception. A 55%-45% win percentage is usually what we are looking at, it's not huge, but it's enough to push us to the 55 squad. But in actual play, the 45 could easily win a given game as well.

My point is, people almost universally over value squad strength. In the Gencon Team tournament, I beat the crap out of a Slow Cannon 200pt squad with Vader Scourge and Cade Skywalker, and I wasn't "lucky" doing it. This isn't to say that I am arguing that any given random assortment of pieces can win. Squad construction is important, but it's not as important as understanding tactics and strategy and out playing your opponent. If you do what you required, "potential to win a tournament (at the usual circumstances -- some good players there, no body is exceptional lucky etc.)" well then to answer your question, any of the existing factions fit that bill, but it also depends on your skill and that of your opponents.

@OLDMANKENOBI: Nym has disruptive so any faction can get that ability. I'm not saying he is a great choice but it can be taken if you feel you have to have it.

Could you elaborate on this? The latest Sith Holo News thing is an hour long, and some people might not have that much time to kill, myself included.

While this might or might not be true, it is beside the point of this poll.


Quite a couple of ifs. TK-4334 didn't ask for Gencon nor did he ask for non-Gencon, so this means not either but both. And while Vong aren't good at Gencon, Rebels are, so Rebels have more potential. Or are there levels or metas in that the Vong make good squads and Rebels don't?

Theophagos

PM Incoming, just for you :) Everyone else, listen to the show :)

All DCI play. It's the DCI rules I am talking about.

There are many things I would say here.

1. Gencon players do not control DCI in anyway.
2. You can participate in the discussions equally to anyone else right now.
3. You aren't going to agree with everything that ends up being done, but that's because DCI has to deal with championship play, local play and everything in between.
4. I really don't like the assertion that "Gencon players" would somehow be bad for the game, and while I think it's a pretty meaningless statement considering number 1 and 2, I still think you will want to be very careful what you say.

Your comment is so far off base it not even funny. Someone will that comment and believe it. Wow!

Please dont make comments out of ignorance. You want a voice in it.... then get involved. It seems you have zero clue of the process I go thru to write the floor rules so if you dont know please dont comment like you do or because a friend told you that is how things happen.

I get so tired of these kind of comments because obviously you have no idea how much time I spend talking to different playgroups getting opinions.

You want your opinion heard.... come to the source.

I will discuss it with anyone. But dont make false statements. You can PM me and I will gladly give you my number.

There's also the matter that the speakers on the computer I'm at right now work so poorly I can't even make out what they're saying.

Which would be helpful, if I had a pair of headphones on hand.

I vote rebels, too they have all nice SA´s for low cost, but i think Imps, Republic, and perhaps NR are close up.


I NEVER lose a game because of bad luck (perhaps 5%) . Sure if the die isn´t with u it can be hard to win. Just my opinion.

Props on the Dawn of Bane squad. I used it this weekend in a tournament no one even came close and I even beat Lobbin' Luke on train station. I was skeptical at first but it played very well. The most points my opponent got was 14.