In the aftermath of WotC's announcement that production of our beloved game is coming to an end, I've read multiple posts contemplating contingency plans for the future of Star War Minis. First off, we are lucky to have such an organized community with dedicated and intelligent fans. But in the midst of reading discussions alluding to things to come, I had a moment of pause concerning the idea of re-costing or customizing older minis for the creation of "official" virtual expansions. While in principle I like the idea of updating minis and creating custom stats, in practice I see some possible problems. Particularly, customizing or recosting older and more inaccessible minis will potentially make it difficult for newer players to obtain said minis, and thus compete against players that already have those minis. A player is already at a disadvantage if they start collecting minis several years after someone else, but updating minis could compound that disadvantage. The proverbial rich would get richer.

For instance, imagine if you started collecting SWMs with the Clone Wars expansion and now have all the minis from every 40 piece set, but then the Community releases some "official" new stats for 60 older minis--all of which are very well done and game changing. Unfortunately, those minis are now extremely difficult to get on the open market (and as time goes on, will continue to become more difficult to obtain). Low and behold, without those new pieces you suddenly find it very difficult to compete in tournament play.

Or perhaps Revan's been updated and is now the well-costed beast every fanboy dreamed he would be. You REALLY want him, but good luck affording him on ebay when his price soars to $80.

A Community release of virtual sets could even lead to a situation where a mini re-designer uses his position to create incredible "official" stats for an older VR mini of which he has multiple duplicates--only to turn around and sell those duplicates on ebay after their value and demand increases substantially.

Are these situations realistic? I don't know. Regardless, I thought they were interesting ethical scenarios. Consequently, does anyone know how/if these issues have been addressed in other games where the community has taken over the designing of new content (e.g. the Star War CCG)? Have any problems arisen?

It's not that I'm against creating new virtual content, I just thought it would be interesting to examine and discuss the potential consequences, along with reasonable solutions.

Thoughts?

I will be honest.
I have been playing since Clone Strike. It was a fairly simple set, and I enjoyed it obviously, because I just got my Dark Times in this week.
Errata on older Miniatures is unacceptable in my Book, even re costing. Whether we liked it or not, Wizards of the Coast created this game (AND I AM IN NO WAY DEFENDING THEM), and we have accepted it as it was, I mean, lets be serious, they got us all hooked. And thats because we enjoy the game for what it is, Growth in Evolution. I like using older pieces, and i dont think they need to be re costed at all.
I also take into consideration availability to all Gamers.
Come the end of May, Wizos stops putting minis on the shelf.
How do we get new people to play if they can't get a booster? I wish I had every piece in the game, but I don't, so I can't be like "Here, just use mine".
Bluedionysius has a good Idea though. If we are going to do virtual sets, we need to start making all of the AVAILABLE minis available in these Virtual sets, like we do with Vassal, except now we will run out of actual minis. I mean lets face it, alot of guys can't/won't mod their figs, especially because of their value (I mod ALL of my expensive Minis.) and the time that goes into doing it.
No Errata on older minis will be accepted by me, whether its abilities and re costs.
I'm fairly certain alot if not half of the community is down for that.
Yes, the RPG community is hurt in all of this as much as us,(I will get to the idea of the card scans) and now more then ever, we need to get some sort of collective bargaining agreement on what needs to be done. Seriously.
If we are all one in the same in this community, then the community needs to put something to a vote......
A POLL.
We all need to vote on what they want from here on in, because if we ALL don't come to some form of agreement, then the community will be more broken then it was Before this game died on us all. You will have different sects of people playing different kinds of skirmishes. 0 consistency. More people sell their S%!T on Ebay, and thats really bad for all of us as a whole.
I liked the idea of card scans for future 'cards', I believe Dnemiller was talking about that. This is Genius. We make the cards available for the "New Figs", and distribute them for a small fee. I mean I am willing to spend up to 50$ for each new card set.
I'm also not saying that is what the fee should be, but I'm just giving an idea of a rough amount.
When we talk further about this, we seriously need to go to a vote.
I appreciate Rabid Wookie for creating this thread, very good job dude.

I'm not sure whose ethics are being questioned, and i really don't care.
Yea, it seems like Polls are fads, I get it, but why not have a Poll that actually means something, instead of the "Whose Hotter, Whose Badder and whose Fatter".
If someones ethics are being questioned, I am not getting involved, but I'm serious when I say I want this game to live.
I get that GOWK is back and all, and great job on that BTW, but he should never have been banned to begin with. And thats only because he should NEVER have been made. SSM got errata'd and everything is Fine with him. I personally had a problem with mettle and MoTF2, but thats just me.
But that does not mean that it is time to start re inventing this game.
I like the Virtual card sets idea, and I don't mind paying for them. Thats where we need to be going at this point, keeping it simple for the bigger picture. If we as a community bite off more then we can chew, and lets say that the SWM title gets picked up. What if the company who bought the rights to the contract (The guys paying for the game) want to go a completely different way.
How many new formats do we have to go through until theres about (hopefully) 1000 people left in the U.S who play SWM.
From Masters of the Force onward, we need to think of something simplistic in order to appease the community we still have.

Coming from the standpoint of a player of both SW Minis and SWCCG, the whole "virtual expansion" thing is a double edged sword...

Where it can be good to keep the game going, it is a pain to play in real life afterwords...
For the players that return to the game, even after a short period, it makes the situation unbearable sometimes. New rules and the complete deletion/change of others can completely turn a game upside down.

I for one think that "virtual sets" will be VERY bad for SW Minis.
I tried to come back to SWCCG a while back, and its not the same game I used to be obsessed with.
I don't want this one to end up the same way...

The problem with that is the same problem with SWCCG...
Other companies will not touch ANY game after an "official" Vset has been released.
And then when a player decides to come back to the game, none of the gamers have separate new/old armies/decks. the problems only snowball from there...

*Sigh* We are only a few days past WotC's announcement. Ideas are just that. Questioning the hard-working community members at this point is a slap in the face IMHO. Things such as Organized Play have been shouldered by the players for a long time (while WotC sat back and did nothing). So that is nothing new.

As for the stats issue, I think virtual sets are a great idea. If you can get more mileage out of an older miniature, I say go for it. I haven't seen some of the older miniatures used in ages. Does that mean the original stats need to be changed? Probably not. Honestly, I don't mind a facelift to the older pieces. They could use it. If that means creating a new, virtual card using an older miniature, I'm all for it. We certainly don't have the resources to be creating new miniatures (the actual plastic miniature). The cards and stats, however, are within reason.

Also of note, I wouldn't worry too much over new players looking for older pieces. I suspect prices will take a plunge as several people abandon the game. Once that's done, prices may go up. That said, if a new player wants to get a hold of pieces for an Out of Date game (so to speak), I don't think price is that big of an issue. The SWM will retain some value. However, I don't see them staying where they have been selling at.

At the rate that we are losing regular members right now, even if individual minis do plunge, it will still be hard to get new folk involved. In my community alone, we have lost 3 players out of 8. I suspect that in 2 weeks, we will be down to 3 left.
I too love the Virtual Sets idea, I think that it would be a good shot in the arm for us all.
With Virtual sets though, nothing can be official, because I'm fairly certain none of us have license rights. So 'unofficial' new cards won't hurt us at all.
I Do think its time to start incorporating the RPG into the game, after all, the game has been heading down this road since LoTF, I think any way. Never having played the RPG before, I'm more then happy to share with the other fellow gamers.
On what I said before about losing members, I won't mention names, but I found alot of members on this site on Ebay selling their minis. I got some of them.
I Bought:
Mon Mothma-1$
Han Cannon- $1.50
Tartful-$1.50
Now these prices are crazy, and its sad to see them go for this much, but its a good way for us to refurbish some of other members collections.
I've already made 'starter sets' for newer players that involve OR some force users and shooters. Rome wasn't built in a day, So we may as well start re-building.

Valid? How so? Unless you're paranoid, I think most of the ideas posted in his comment are ridiculous.

At this point, was this thread even necessary? If "we" aren't clear on what's up, I see no purpose in questioning things that haven't even occurred.

I can see why your name is Tirade.
The name of the thread is in Bad taste, I will admit that, but it doesn't change the fact that there are questions that need answers. Do not quote me if you can't understand what I am saying. There is no need to be defensive, especially if know just as much as any of us.
If this is a personal thing between the Poster and Dnemiller, then leave it between them. Taking sides at this point is ridiculous and moot. That has gotten us nowhere in the last few months, and it certainly won't get us any where now. If you feel the need to be confrontational, take it up with Wizards of the Coast. They created this problem, voice your opinion to them.
As afr as being paranoid goes, yes, I guess you can say that I'm slightly on edge when it comes to the future of the ONLY table top game I will ever play. So color me paranoid if you want, but the solution rests in ALL of our hands, not just one person. You would be better off for knowing that.
SOLIDARITY people, if you want Chaos, go somewhere else, because it isn't welcome here.

As long as the community has a say so, I don't really see a problem with virtual sets.
Gen Con is a priority, but don't forget, most of the members on this site arent going to GenCon, for whatever reasons they have. I'm sure gen Con is in excellent hands, but Gencon is in August, 3 months after Wizos stops stocking shelves.
I appreciate the committee, but I think we need to expand it into 2 groups perhaps.
One committee for genCon, and the other in pushing out the virtual sets.
I'm not part of any 'circle', but I am part of the community. The community needs to be the committee.