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Galactic Funk
Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 10:11:49 AM
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If we are talking some kind of boost to Rebel Troopers someone could design a Captain Raymus Antilles. I don't think he exists in SWM. The guy who gets choked to death by Vader and then flung against a wall deserves something, right? Obviously he wouldn't be powerful, just something that could do something fun for troopers.

And for Hoth Troopers a new Riekan could be cool to boost them too. Kill two birds with one stone, make an unused piece fun to break out and keep the current Riekan off the board, lol! Of course a lot more people would really prefer Dodonna off the board.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 10:26:54 AM
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Galactic Funk wrote:
If we are talking some kind of boost to Rebel Troopers someone could design a Captain Raymus Antilles. I don't think he exists in SWM. The guy who gets choked to death by Vader and then flung against a wall deserves something, right? Obviously he wouldn't be powerful, just something that could do something fun for troopers.

And for Hoth Troopers a new Riekan could be cool to boost them too. Kill two birds with one stone, make an unused piece fun to break out and keep the current Riekan off the board, lol! Of course a lot more people would really prefer Dodonna off the board.


He exists in the Republic, but no Rebel version. I started this thread so that details of the Rebel Trooper discussion don't completely derail the "obsolete" vs "improve" discussion:

http://www.bloomilk.com/Forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=11552
Galactic Funk
Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 10:53:59 AM
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Good idea for that thread.

Keeping this one on track, I guess it doesn't matter a tremendous amount to me if its a boost to the old pieces or a straight up upgrade. My preference is probably a boost but I suppose there would be times a upgrade would be fine too.

Most importantly is that there is some sort of reason to use a mini. I dislike having a whole assortmant of a certain character type (such as Rebel Troopers) with no reason to use the sculpts. Some way, some how, give people a reason to break them out.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 11:29:24 AM
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Something else I just thought of. In general, I'd rather to boost a piece than replace it, but there are some pieces where I'd care more and some where I'd care less. I think the basic troopers for each faction should be boosted - not replaced. I think of them as a basic staple that shouldn't be tossed into the back of the box. Basic troopers aren't supposed to be good on their own anyway... they need commanders. I'd rather see the commanders (e.g. Rebel Captain) become obsolete than the Rebel Trooper.

I'd also care a lot less if Arcona Smuggler was replaced by Veteran Arcona Smuggler. It's not a high profile piece, whereas a faction's basic troopers are kind of iconic of the faction. This is probably also why I was so disappointed with GMLS version 2. GMLS is a very high profile piece, and now it's completely eclipsed, such that it could only be brought back to life through direct named boosts.
sharron
Posted: Thursday, September 20, 2012 4:15:39 PM
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Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this

Malak, Sith Apprentice
sith, cost- 28

HP-100
Def-19
Att-11
Dam-20

unique
melee attack
twin attack
Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best)
Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)

force 4
sith rage
lightsaber deflect



Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.
sharron
Posted: Thursday, September 20, 2012 4:24:15 PM
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but make it so he couldnt be used with the new one...
EmporerDragon
Posted: Thursday, September 20, 2012 6:53:26 PM
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sharron wrote:
and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.


Well, with a cost of 0, he becomes the ultimate meatshield.
luke hates thrawn
Posted: Friday, September 21, 2012 12:20:06 AM
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I think a rebel trooper squad varient would be a healthy and much needed change to the faction which in that past has always needed a "unique" (sorry i couldnt help myself) cast of characters. Mix it up a bit and create something new that people will use.
CerousMutor
Posted: Friday, September 21, 2012 2:04:46 AM
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sharron wrote:
Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this

Malak, Sith Apprentice
sith, cost- 28

HP-100
Def-19
Att-11
Dam-20

unique
melee attack
twin attack
Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best)
Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)

force 4
sith rage
lightsaber deflect



Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.


Seems too much at first; but when you think about it it makes perfect sense. Even at half Hit points!
countrydude82487
Posted: Friday, September 21, 2012 9:07:00 AM
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Posts: 1,233
CerousMutor wrote:
sharron wrote:
Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this

Malak, Sith Apprentice
sith, cost- 28

HP-100
Def-19
Att-11
Dam-20

unique
melee attack
twin attack
Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best)
Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)

force 4
sith rage
lightsaber deflect



Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.


Seems too much at first; but when you think about it it makes perfect sense. Even at half Hit points!


i could see something like this
BUt i would change Camraderie to be
Camraderie(A character in your squad named Darth Revan gains Greater mobile attack and Master of the force 2)

IT would not only allow him to block more attacks, but allow him a similar damage output to the new revan, plus he could move 10 and do it, which could work to his advantage.
Jedi_Master
Posted: Sunday, September 23, 2012 7:30:07 AM
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I think the general opinion here is the following: Make new pieces that bring back older pieces, don't make new pieces that replace older pieces.

The general way to do that in people's opinion is abilities like fire control, squad whichever, and rapport and I tend to agree. If it costs to much, make a unit that lowers its cost. If it isn't a part of the power creep, give it more firepower. The answer is not to replace it, not ever.
sharron
Posted: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 5:48:36 AM
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EmporerDragon wrote:
sharron wrote:
and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.


Well, with a cost of 0, he becomes the ultimate meatshield.



Maybe revan costs 28 less, would that be better
kezzamachine
Posted: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 3:46:23 PM
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Location: Lower the Hutt, New Zealand
Not sure if I've said my preference, but I don't have a problem with making new pieces that replace older ones. That's life. WotC did it, we do it. Sometimes you make something and then think, 'oh, that didn't work'. No one pours new wine into an old wineskin... they get a new wineskin! (I don't even drink wine, so I have no idea what that means).

I am happy with seeing new versions of big characters too. Bring on multiple Luke's, Vader's, Ani's etc. (Still waiting for that uber-melee Rebel Luke that will probably come out after I'm dead or something - Vset402 or who knows).

I could go into more detail as to why I think these things, but won't now (I'm s'posed to be teaching...). As an extra, although I don't speak for them on this issue, the NZ crew has never really said anything about this because, I'm guessing, they don't regard it as an issue.
TheHutts
Posted: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 4:31:46 PM
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kezzamachine wrote:
I could go into more detail as to why I think these things, but won't now (I'm s'posed to be teaching...). As an extra, although I don't speak for them on this issue, the NZ crew has never really said anything about this because, I'm guessing, they don't regard it as an issue.


I think most of us New Zealanders came into the game relatively late, or after, WotC production, so we don't have older pieces that are sitting round waiting to be empowered. A big chunk of my pieces (about 2/3) are from Legacy of the Force or later - and underused pieces from that era seem to be easier to prop up than ones from the earlier sets, like Atris/Echanis and Winter/Leia JK.

As well as the practical reasons that echo24 and others have mentioned, I'd much rather get a completely new Grievous that I can use a proxy for, rather than hunt down a VR from Revenge of the Sith because there's a companion piece for it. I'm all for people being able to compete without having to spend lots of money on pieces, and I like that the game's going that way - the GenCon winning squads from the last couple of years have been very cheap to construct (apart from building up a collection of Lobot reinforcements), with no need for a $50 chase piece or 10 mouse droids. It should be about playing skill and meta-reading, not about who's spent the most money on the game.
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, September 27, 2012 5:20:25 AM
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Jedi_Master wrote:
I think the general opinion here is the following: Make new pieces that bring back older pieces, don't make new pieces that replace older pieces.


I don't think thats the general opinion. I think that's the opinion on the Rebel Trooper. However, there are plenty of us here who see the value of recreating a piece, depending on the piece (Reven and GGJH being great examples)
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