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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/25/2011 Posts: 806 Location: Wisconsin
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If we are talking some kind of boost to Rebel Troopers someone could design a Captain Raymus Antilles. I don't think he exists in SWM. The guy who gets choked to death by Vader and then flung against a wall deserves something, right? Obviously he wouldn't be powerful, just something that could do something fun for troopers.
And for Hoth Troopers a new Riekan could be cool to boost them too. Kill two birds with one stone, make an unused piece fun to break out and keep the current Riekan off the board, lol! Of course a lot more people would really prefer Dodonna off the board.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
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Galactic Funk wrote:If we are talking some kind of boost to Rebel Troopers someone could design a Captain Raymus Antilles. I don't think he exists in SWM. The guy who gets choked to death by Vader and then flung against a wall deserves something, right? Obviously he wouldn't be powerful, just something that could do something fun for troopers.
And for Hoth Troopers a new Riekan could be cool to boost them too. Kill two birds with one stone, make an unused piece fun to break out and keep the current Riekan off the board, lol! Of course a lot more people would really prefer Dodonna off the board. He exists in the Republic, but no Rebel version. I started this thread so that details of the Rebel Trooper discussion don't completely derail the "obsolete" vs "improve" discussion: http://www.bloomilk.com/Forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=11552
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/25/2011 Posts: 806 Location: Wisconsin
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Good idea for that thread.
Keeping this one on track, I guess it doesn't matter a tremendous amount to me if its a boost to the old pieces or a straight up upgrade. My preference is probably a boost but I suppose there would be times a upgrade would be fine too.
Most importantly is that there is some sort of reason to use a mini. I dislike having a whole assortmant of a certain character type (such as Rebel Troopers) with no reason to use the sculpts. Some way, some how, give people a reason to break them out.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
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Something else I just thought of. In general, I'd rather to boost a piece than replace it, but there are some pieces where I'd care more and some where I'd care less. I think the basic troopers for each faction should be boosted - not replaced. I think of them as a basic staple that shouldn't be tossed into the back of the box. Basic troopers aren't supposed to be good on their own anyway... they need commanders. I'd rather see the commanders (e.g. Rebel Captain) become obsolete than the Rebel Trooper.
I'd also care a lot less if Arcona Smuggler was replaced by Veteran Arcona Smuggler. It's not a high profile piece, whereas a faction's basic troopers are kind of iconic of the faction. This is probably also why I was so disappointed with GMLS version 2. GMLS is a very high profile piece, and now it's completely eclipsed, such that it could only be brought back to life through direct named boosts.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/11/2009 Posts: 460
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Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this
Malak, Sith Apprentice sith, cost- 28
HP-100 Def-19 Att-11 Dam-20
unique melee attack twin attack Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best) Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)
force 4 sith rage lightsaber deflect
Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/11/2009 Posts: 460
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but make it so he couldnt be used with the new one...
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/26/2008 Posts: 2,115 Location: Watertown, SD
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sharron wrote: and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective. Well, with a cost of 0, he becomes the ultimate meatshield.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/29/2008 Posts: 283 Location: Indianapolis. In.
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I think a rebel trooper squad varient would be a healthy and much needed change to the faction which in that past has always needed a "unique" (sorry i couldnt help myself) cast of characters. Mix it up a bit and create something new that people will use.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/27/2008 Posts: 990
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sharron wrote:Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this
Malak, Sith Apprentice sith, cost- 28
HP-100 Def-19 Att-11 Dam-20
unique melee attack twin attack Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best) Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)
force 4 sith rage lightsaber deflect
Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective. Seems too much at first; but when you think about it it makes perfect sense. Even at half Hit points!
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/26/2008 Posts: 1,233
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CerousMutor wrote:sharron wrote:Why not a piece that only worked with old Revan, such as a Malak, something like this
Malak, Sith Apprentice sith, cost- 28
HP-100 Def-19 Att-11 Dam-20
unique melee attack twin attack Camraderie(A character in your squad with the name Darth Revan gains X (lightsaber deflect, or assault, or both, or whatever anyone sees fit to work best) Rapport(this character costs no points if in the same squad as Darth Revan)
force 4 sith rage lightsaber deflect
Would that work? I dont know how that stats would go, but he would be alright on his own, and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective. Seems too much at first; but when you think about it it makes perfect sense. Even at half Hit points! i could see something like this BUt i would change Camraderie to be Camraderie(A character in your squad named Darth Revan gains Greater mobile attack and Master of the force 2) IT would not only allow him to block more attacks, but allow him a similar damage output to the new revan, plus he could move 10 and do it, which could work to his advantage.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/9/2008 Posts: 110
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I think the general opinion here is the following: Make new pieces that bring back older pieces, don't make new pieces that replace older pieces.
The general way to do that in people's opinion is abilities like fire control, squad whichever, and rapport and I tend to agree. If it costs to much, make a unit that lowers its cost. If it isn't a part of the power creep, give it more firepower. The answer is not to replace it, not ever.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/11/2009 Posts: 460
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EmporerDragon wrote:sharron wrote: and then with Revan he makes him considerably more effective. Well, with a cost of 0, he becomes the ultimate meatshield. Maybe revan costs 28 less, would that be better
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 9/23/2008 Posts: 1,487 Location: Lower the Hutt, New Zealand
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Not sure if I've said my preference, but I don't have a problem with making new pieces that replace older ones. That's life. WotC did it, we do it. Sometimes you make something and then think, 'oh, that didn't work'. No one pours new wine into an old wineskin... they get a new wineskin! (I don't even drink wine, so I have no idea what that means).
I am happy with seeing new versions of big characters too. Bring on multiple Luke's, Vader's, Ani's etc. (Still waiting for that uber-melee Rebel Luke that will probably come out after I'm dead or something - Vset402 or who knows).
I could go into more detail as to why I think these things, but won't now (I'm s'posed to be teaching...). As an extra, although I don't speak for them on this issue, the NZ crew has never really said anything about this because, I'm guessing, they don't regard it as an issue.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
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kezzamachine wrote:I could go into more detail as to why I think these things, but won't now (I'm s'posed to be teaching...). As an extra, although I don't speak for them on this issue, the NZ crew has never really said anything about this because, I'm guessing, they don't regard it as an issue. I think most of us New Zealanders came into the game relatively late, or after, WotC production, so we don't have older pieces that are sitting round waiting to be empowered. A big chunk of my pieces (about 2/3) are from Legacy of the Force or later - and underused pieces from that era seem to be easier to prop up than ones from the earlier sets, like Atris/Echanis and Winter/Leia JK. As well as the practical reasons that echo24 and others have mentioned, I'd much rather get a completely new Grievous that I can use a proxy for, rather than hunt down a VR from Revenge of the Sith because there's a companion piece for it. I'm all for people being able to compete without having to spend lots of money on pieces, and I like that the game's going that way - the GenCon winning squads from the last couple of years have been very cheap to construct (apart from building up a collection of Lobot reinforcements), with no need for a $50 chase piece or 10 mouse droids. It should be about playing skill and meta-reading, not about who's spent the most money on the game.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 9/16/2008 Posts: 2,302
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Jedi_Master wrote:I think the general opinion here is the following: Make new pieces that bring back older pieces, don't make new pieces that replace older pieces.
I don't think thats the general opinion. I think that's the opinion on the Rebel Trooper. However, there are plenty of us here who see the value of recreating a piece, depending on the piece (Reven and GGJH being great examples)
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