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Force Absorb and Re-Rolling and MoTF2 Options
Dr Daman
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 10:56:18 AM
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If a character that has MoTF2 uses a FP to re-roll a failed save, and an adjacent character uses Force Absorb to cancel the re-roll, can the 1st character then use another FP to make the same re-roll?

This came up in a game recently when Mace was toe-to-toe with Satele and she failed her parry save on a crit. Mace Absorbed the FPRR, but we weren't sure if Satele could still use her 2nd FP.
Sithborg
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 11:08:14 AM
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Yup, you could still reroll, as MOTF 2 would allow you to reroll twice a turn.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 1:13:51 PM
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Sithborg wrote:
Yup, you could still reroll, as MOTF 2 would allow you to reroll twice a turn.



you could not use lightsaber defense on an attack, have it absorbed, then use lightsaber defense again on that same attack correct?
Sithborg
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 1:21:37 PM
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Deaths_Baine wrote:
Sithborg wrote:
Yup, you could still reroll, as MOTF 2 would allow you to reroll twice a turn.



you could not use lightsaber defense on an attack, have it absorbed, then use lightsaber defense again on that same attack correct?


No, you can use Lightsaber Defense again if the first was cancelled.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 1:27:57 PM
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Sithborg wrote:
Deaths_Baine wrote:
Sithborg wrote:
Yup, you could still reroll, as MOTF 2 would allow you to reroll twice a turn.



you could not use lightsaber defense on an attack, have it absorbed, then use lightsaber defense again on that same attack correct?


No, you can use Lightsaber Defense again if the first was cancelled.


Glossary Text

(Force; 2 Force points) A character using this Force power cancels the effects of a Force power used by an adjacent character. You must decide whether to use Force Absorb immediately after the other Force power is declared but before it takes effect. That Force power is still considered to have been used that turn, and the affected character still spends the Force points.

Since it was considered to have been used, would that not go against using force powers to respond to the same attack twice? Like you can lightsaber defense, then reroll it, but you cant lightsaber defense and then lightsaber defense again.
Sithborg
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 3:03:54 PM
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You can lightsaber defense an attack as many times as you can spend Force Points. There is no actual rule against it. However, you only get to benefit from it once. When it is cancelled, you don't benefit from it.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 4:22:10 PM
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Sithborg wrote:
You can lightsaber defense an attack as many times as you can spend Force Points. There is no actual rule against it. However, you only get to benefit from it once. When it is cancelled, you don't benefit from it.



10. Resolve effects that trigger when this character is hit. Some effects trigger (or can voluntarily be triggered) when the target is hit by an attack, such as Evade, Flurry, Lightsaber Block, Lightsaber Deflect, Lightsaber Reflect, and Lightsaber Riposte. (Force Points may be used to reroll saves on this step, if the character is still able to use Force Points during this turn.) If multiple effects trigger, use the simultaneous effects rule to determine the order in which they are resolved. You may see the results of one effect before resolving another, but no single effect may be resolved more than once. For example, a character can never Lightsaber Deflect the same attack twice. (Effects such as Flurry and Lightsaber Riposte begin new attack sequences that interrupt this sequence; resolve the new attack completely, then continue where you left off with the original attack.)


not sure how that work with what you just said..... it says NEVER deflect the same attack twice the lightsaber defense would still be considered to of been used therefore you should not be able to use it again on the same attack.....
Sithborg
Posted: Friday, October 5, 2012 6:03:46 PM
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Master of the Force allows them to use the same Force Power twice. Stacking prevents benefiting from the same effect (in this case, making a save to prevent damage) more than once.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 9:04:58 AM
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Sithborg wrote:
Master of the Force allows them to use the same Force Power twice. Stacking prevents benefiting from the same effect (in this case, making a save to prevent damage) more than once.


Ok question lets take the new Darth Revan if I give him illusion and you attack me and you make your illusion save could I illusion it again? I did not benefit from illusion, because I would still be taking the damage. Or is the dice roll considered benefitting from the force power not the actual result? But if that were the case I don't understand how absorbing it which says it was still considered to have been used would be much different other then the physical dice roll...
Sithborg
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 9:33:15 AM
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The save is part of the effect. You can only benefit/be affected of an ability per instance of when it would be triggered. No matter what, you can only get one Illusion save per attack.

The part about still considered to have been used is there to denote all costs of the power are still used, ie Force Points, attacks, turn, usage of Force Points...
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 9:46:34 AM
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Sithborg wrote:
The save is part of the effect. You can only benefit/be affected of an ability per instance of when it would be triggered. No matter what, you can only get one Illusion save per attack.

The part about still considered to have been used is there to denote all costs of the power are still used, ie Force Points, attacks, turn, usage of Force Points...



Ok I think I get it, all the wording had me a little confused. But to add on then could I only force Alter an attack once because when they reroll would it not be considered the original attack still just a new roll for it?
urbanjedi
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 10:30:11 AM
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Except Alter specifically allows itself to be used multiple times on the same attack.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 1:16:25 PM
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urbanjedi wrote:
Except Alter specifically allows itself to be used multiple times on the same attack.



How? It just says on the last attack in the glossary says nothing about multiple times?
Sithborg
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 1:21:54 PM
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He might be thinking about Reroll. I may have to look it up, but for some reason I was thinking you could, but I can't think of the logic right now. So for now, you can only use Alter once per attack.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, October 6, 2012 1:30:57 PM
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Sithborg wrote:
He might be thinking about Reroll. I may have to look it up, but for some reason I was thinking you could, but I can't think of the logic right now. So for now, you can only use Alter once per attack.



sorry for all this by the way lol, just want to understand it.
urbanjedi
Posted: Sunday, October 7, 2012 3:24:23 PM
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This ancient thread from the old WOTC days and Nickname

http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/19456010/Force_for_extra_movement?post_id=347853249#347853249

says that Force Stun and Alter as well as Move Faster are all pre-nickname but can be benefited from multiple times.
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