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How to play faster Options
Darth_Jim
Posted: Thursday, February 28, 2013 8:42:22 PM
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One of the topics discussed on the Sith Holonews Network tonight was slowplay. Frostycon saw a lot of games go to time. We talked about some of the possible reasons that it happened, but then questioned how we avoid a trend of more games going to time moving forward. As the regional season looms on the horizon, what can we do to have more complete games? I'll start the ball rolling with a few observations, but I'd like to hear what the community thinks.

Know your squad: While it's not unusual to ask your opponent to show you the card of a piece you've not seen played very much, how often do you catch yourself looking at your own cards during play? One way I see to speed up your own play is to know your squad. You should know the stats, of course, but also know the role that each piece plays in your squad. Sometimes the same piece will play differently depending on the squad that it is in. Not knowing the very best way to play a piece not only robs you of possible synergy and squad strength, but you'll naturally play more deliberately. Why is he in there? Should he be exposed to attack? Is he an early round spin or maybe a late round swap piece? Know the strategic answers to all of the questions you could bring up about the pieces in your squad, and you'll shave a lot of time off of mid-round deliberations.
urbanjedi
Posted: Thursday, February 28, 2013 10:02:31 PM
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Joined: 4/30/2008
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I'll add a couple quick things now and probably more later.

1. As Nickname always said, you have to make the best move possible in a reasonable amount of time, you can't spend tons of time searching for the "perfect" move. Doing so often doesn't net you a better move than if you would have gone with the move you had been thinking about since last round while your opp was moving.

2. Realize that not scoring 200 pts in a game isn't technically a win, it is a draw. I often see players struggling because they are more worried about what their opp is going to do than what their squad is doing. Just like in sports, if you are playing to win (as opposed to playing not to lose) you will find that you will start to finish more games and probably start becoming a better player.

3. As Jim stated, know your squad and what you want to do, at least with a few opening moves. Move this guy to the door and blow it, move that guy 12 to that spot, etc. I can't tell you how many games that it's almost always my opps turn because for the first few moves of the game it either doesn't matter where I go / what I do or I already know that I am going to move to that particular square.

4. Don't just wait around for your opp to make a mistake. HE ISN'T GOING TO. The days of counting on your opp to make a mistake are over. If you have a mismatch for your squad, you have to just take your lumps and maybe the dice gods will smile on your favor. Hiding in the corner (or the back) isn't going to change the mismatch.
TimmerB123
Posted: Thursday, February 28, 2013 10:08:03 PM
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Joined: 7/9/2008
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Just like some players naturally play faster than others - some SQUADS play faster than others. You have to know what type of squad you have.

More activations take more time. You may hear the argument that number of activations doesn't change how fast the squad plays, but this is wrong. It does take longer, and therefore if you play high activations, you must consciously play faster.

Typically squads with mass killers (galloping attack, strafe, blaster barrage, furious assault, Kaan Bomb, unleash the force, etc) play faster - though there are exceptions. The typical high activation single lancer squad can take a very long time to play the first few rounds. Counting out different routes for 72 squares can take quite a lot of time. (Pawn, lancer, auto win init with MTB and lancer again) - BUT - it SHOULD make up the difference by killing enough to balance out the time. In other words, there are typically less rounds in Lancer games. It's an unfair assessment in such squads to simply time one round, but you must be able to finish games in order to not have that come into play in the judges eyes.

Melee also tends to be faster than non-melee believe it or not. Melee HAS to engage, so win or lose action is going to happen.

Mobile/stealth/cloaked shooter squads, especially ones without major movement breakers (ie thrawn) tend to play the slowest. Especially high activation squads of these types. Mandos and Rebels tend to be these types of squads.

And of course when these squads face each other, then it's a real cagey match which is hard to finish.

Similar number of activations and similar squads can actually create a standoff sort of situation as well, and make games hard to finish.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying that all shooter and or rebel/mando squads are slow and cannot earn 3 pt wins. They can - but the player may have to play that much faster.


So analyze if you are innately a faster player or not. If not - think about the squad type you are using. Try more Melee, and/or less activaions. If you must play high activations, include a mass killer or a large movement breaker to get to key pieces fast. Regardless, learn to play your squad very fast, to make up for the times you may be playing a slower player.


Full disclosure - I innately am not a faster player. In fact I enjoy the game much more when I can finish a full game at leisure, with both myself and my opponents getting to make their best move. When I play casually, I will take a game to conclusion and not care about time. But that doesn't work at tournaments. I had to accept that other people don't like to play this way. They don't enjoy the "chess match" games. Some certainly still do, but we as a community have moved to make competitive play fit into an hour, whether or not the game really lends itself to that anymore (which I think that it does not, but that is a different conversation).

So about 3 or 4 years ago I had to try and consciously make the transition to finishing games in tournaments. It took some effort, and I am still not perfect, but I certainly finish far more than I don't now. A big part of that was squad building. I really feel like there are some strong squads out there, that just don't play fast enough to get consistent 3 pt wins. IG-86 swarms, Mando death-shot scouts, Weir storm commandos (without a speeder) are some to name a few. Rock solid tough, but so hard to get 3 pt wins with them unless you are playing noobs or facing mostly melee that has to throw themselves at you. So I was very thorough in my squad building to build squads that can play faster. It became a requirement and very early assessment point on if I would play a squad. Stealth N Blue has the big mass killer in Arica with her sniper twin blaster barrage. Thrawn helps her get in place and usually get at lest 2 off (end of round and beginning of next round). Then you have Cad Bane to finish off the big guys. The downside is that they are both squishy, so you still have to play it cagey. My Sith squad "Jaqed Up!" uses the big movement breaker of Reven to get Kaan in place for the mass killer bomb, and has Jaq shooting for up to 100 damage to kill bigger stuff. Reven is sweet sweet cleanup. Just a couple of examples of being cognizant of how I am going to kill lots of figures. Having one or two big dudes that can lay down 120-200 damage on 1 or enemies if great if you face that type of squad. But what do you do when you face a swarm? Some people will play high activations, and you may have to face them. If you can only realistically kill 1-2 figures a round, how are you gonna kill all 25 activations on that high activation squad? Knowing WHAT to do against any type of squad sure speeds things up. My rebel squad I played this weekend didn't play fast enough for me, and I won't play it again. It didn't help facing nearly all other mobile/stealth/cloaked shooter squads, but that is something that is out of my control and you have to prepare for.

So that is my long winded bit of advice simplified: It starts even before "knowing you squad". It starts when you build it. Build it to play fast.
jak
Posted: Friday, March 1, 2013 6:27:26 AM
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Confused I've said it before.

SLOW PLAY IS CAUSED BY SLOW PLAYERS

the ones who count the squares a dozen times
try line on sight before they even activate a piece
out activate you, then take forever to finish the round
have a hard time adding +7 attack +cunning+ rangefinder+combined fire


MHO: attack attack attack, you'll surprise the poodoo out of some players, and it may just work.
activate your pieces quickly and your opponent may follow .
verbally encourage slower players to pick up the pace(be honest & cool about it)
know the number you need BEFORE you roll the D20.


while all the ideas in this thread will help. the key issue is taking a 200 pt, 2 hr game, and cramming
it into 1 hr.

to be fair: we need a system where each player gets 30 min. for all his turns in the game.


sorryCursing slow play is a peeve o'mineBlushing


juice man
Posted: Friday, March 1, 2013 7:09:51 AM
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Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
IE, "scream and leap".
thereisnotry
Posted: Friday, March 1, 2013 8:42:40 AM
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Good advice so far.

I think the single best piece of advice is to Know your squad. Inside and out. Really, if you're prepared you should never need to look at your cards, because you know what every piece is capable of and what its attack and defense options are. This comes with experience, yes...but it also comes with preparation.


The second thing I always say is "Think on your opponent's turn." This tidbit actually has a couple of different applications:

1. Obviously, while your opponent is counting out his squares, you should be already planning your next moves; this will allow you to make your moves more quickly when it's your turn. It also means that you'll be more calm and you won't have to "sweat it," because you will have effectively doubled your available thinking time. This saves mental energy, and as anyone knows who's struggled through a 4-6 round tourney, competitive SWM is as much a contest of mental fortitude and endurance as it is of strategy.

Furthermore, it sometimes happens that when you will throw your opponent off of his game when he takes 2 minutes to make his moves and then you take 10 seconds and say "your turn," he'll feel pressured to move more quickly than he's ready to, and will sometimes therefore make a mistake. This isn't the main reason to think during your opponent's turn, but it is a nice side-benefit when it happens.

2. The second main application of Thinking on your opponent's turn is that it will allow you to strategize better. Are you often stuck not knowing what to do with a certain piece? Then think about what your opponent is specifically trying to do. That is, if you know your opponent's squad decently well, you'll be able to think for yourself what his likely best moves or tactics will be in a given situation. Knowing this will help you to decide which moves are the best for you to make in response, even before he makes his move. This allows you to play more confidently and therefore more quickly. If you know what your opponent ideally wants to do, you can take measures to counteract it, before he even makes his move. This is often known as "Staying one step ahead of your opponent"...it's a very powerful tactic, and it starts with you thinking on your opponent's turn.


Know your squad, and think on your opponent's turn. Those are the 2 crucial things that I keep in mind when trying to play quickly.
fingersandteeth
Posted: Friday, March 1, 2013 12:05:31 PM
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This topic does the rounds every now and again and while a lot of the advice above is worth adhering sometimes its just the tactics that prevent games going to time.

If an opponent doesn't give you anything and is playing defensively then often its not worth your while engaging. It can cause stalemates but other than losing outright what other choice to you have?

If an opponent brings a map/squad your not prepared against (which is much more common these days with the choice at the top) then that can mess with your thought process and retard play.


At some point you have to realize that often the game itself doesn't adhere well to an hour.
If you assume a phase every 30 seconds and people are playing 15 to 22 activations with tempo control you're looking at a 20 minute round, that's 4 rounds an hour not including the difficult phases that will take longer.

Republic and sith squads are fine generally. Its usually kill or be killed, lots of easy to play and field mass killers and speed out the wazoo. Round or two of set up and then smash.
OR are also pretty good with no tempo control and good power (also a way to reduce opponents tempo control) which can speed games up.
NR are pretty good because the tempo control tends to be used as a set up to throw a nuke of some kind at the opponent.

Mando's and Vong suffer with lack of movement breaking and so need to wait for the opponent to give them things. Its a slow process and cagey. Hopefully vset 5 might address the issue further with what Vset 4 started.

Separatist squads (top of the top tier at the moment) are often irritating to play against because they tend to sit behind mass tempo control with a mass killer lancer. Playing against it often gives people brain freeze (at least with me it does) and you have to play overly cautious to avoid getting wrecked. This can make for some slow paced rounds that you can't really pin on the guy who's trying to deal with the prospect of getting 50% of his squad wiped with a single bad move.

Imps play similar but they don't really have a mass killer other than Arica and less effective spamming of cheap units make them less of pain. But still they play with generally weaker pieces that over-reach and so must play carefully with caution. As such, games can take time to develop.

Rebels are like imps without a swap. Lots of pieces, fairly fragile but decent power, no real mass killers. However, they are probably more reliant on Tempo control than any other faction because of their fragility even though they probably don't use it as well as the Seps because they don't have such a reach. They do have some tanks but they are generally not their best pieces.

Perhaps these are some things to think about when designing in future.
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