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Trandoshans Options
Lightsaber
Posted: Sunday, August 25, 2024 6:39:38 PM
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So, in Lower Hutt we've been playing a 100pt Species tournament, and I'm running Trandoshans.
How does Rend work with the [Twin Blaster 20] ability that [Garnac on Trandoshan Skiff] gives out?
For instance, if [Bossk, Ultimate Predator] uses Weapons Expert to use [Twin Blaster 20] twice, does he get the +20 damage to his last 3 attacks, every second attack, or just the second attack?
Also, on a side note, how does targeting work when targeting Trandoshans on the Skiff? They're considered to have cover, so is the attacker forced to attack the skiff (if the skiff has no cover)?
adamb0nd
Posted: Sunday, August 25, 2024 9:15:47 PM
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I don't think you can trigger tend on any twin attack. From the FAQ:


Q: If a Yuzzum or Wampa gets an immediate attack or Extra Attack from a commander effect can this attack trigger Rend?

A: No. A character with Rend must hit with both its attacks from Double Claw Attack or Double Attack on its turn for Rend to trigger. Extra Attacks, and immediate attacks that fall before, between, or after those attacks do not factor into the determination of Rend.
adamb0nd
Posted: Sunday, August 25, 2024 9:27:05 PM
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The language on the trandoshan skiff is similar to the original skiff from bounty hunters set. Also from the FAQ:

Quote:
Q: Can characters on the Skiff be attacked or targeted?

A: Yes, but they have cover granted by the Skiff itself so few characters will be able to target them for an attack. You count range, if necessary, by counting from the attacker to the Skiff and
adding one.



You can only target the closest enemy or enemies without cover normally, so most characters won't be able to target the passengers.

Interestingly, the FAQ states that the Sniper SA does not ignore the cover granted by the skiff SA. I guess because that cover granted is from an SA and is not from the character blocking los, which is what sniper needs to trigger.
DarkDracul
Posted: Monday, August 26, 2024 7:27:38 PM
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I think we need a more definitive ruling here.

Twin Blaster 20 is not Extra Attacks or an immediate attack.
The character is making more than one attack on the character's turn.
Zeb Orrelios gets Rend +10 with Bo-Rifle and doesn't have Double Claw Attack or Double Attack.

Unless the ruling is . . . you only get one instance of Rend in a turn.
Bossk Ultimate Pretator could Twin Blaster 20 twice getting Rend +20 every second attack if both hit.


gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Monday, August 26, 2024 9:28:18 PM
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Rend is a little messy since it's been combined with several abilities other than the two it originally worked with (Double and Double Claw). So the FAQ is a little outdated and doesn't answer interactions which came up later.

How this has been ruled is that you must hit the first two attacks on your turn to get the Rend bonus on the second one- and it doesn't matter what source they come from (can be Double, Double Claw, LS Assault, Bo-rifle, Triple, and so forth). If you have Double or Double Claw and Extra then it's still the first two attacks- you can't make it the 2nd and 3rd attack, and Rend only triggers once. The consistent exception which cannot trigger Rend has been Twin Attack, since Twin does not follow the same rules as a usual attack.

Since the second attack of Twin Blaster follows exactly the same rules as Twin Attack, it also falls into the same exception and you cannot trigger the Rend bonus on the "Twin" of Twin Blaster. However, Bossk using Twin Blaster twice with Weapons Expert could get Rend if his 1st and 3rd (non-Twin) attacks hit the same adjacent enemy.
Lightsaber
Posted: Monday, August 26, 2024 11:41:57 PM
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Great, thanks all! Another question - Garnac grants allies Damage Reduction 20 (under certain circumstances), which reduces any incoming damage by 20 if the attacker is nonadjacent. If an attacker is standing adjacent to the skiff and attacks a Trandoshan on the Skiff, does the Trandoshan get the DR20 or not?
adamb0nd
Posted: Tuesday, August 27, 2024 5:07:14 AM
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The card text on dr 20 is incomplete. If you read it's glossary entry, it's only adjacent attacks from enemies with a lightsaber.

I'm not sure if you can be adjacent to an enemy passenger of the trandoshan skiff. The other skiff ability states count distance +1 (while the trandoshan skiff ability doesn't reference that). If it's all the same, only melee reach could hit them as adjacent. I'm not sure if this is ruled the same though.
DarkDracul
Posted: Wednesday, August 28, 2024 4:33:46 PM
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Ignore the weird card text, DR20 works the same as DR10.

Trandoshan Skiff is more similar to Troop Cart. You can be adjacent to and attack a passenger.

If an allied Trandoshan (passenger or not) has activated it's getting DR20. If unactivated it's not getting DR20.

FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, August 28, 2024 8:54:35 PM
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Gandalf gave a great answer on Rend. I do think it's worth mentioning that it's the first two regular (non twin) attacks, and"bonus" attacks that may or may not trigger (like Flurry) also don't count for Rend.
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, August 29, 2024 9:51:49 PM
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This is interesting, because twin blaster is not defined or written like twin attack. Twin blaster just says make 2 attacks, where as twin attack specifies that it interrupts to make a second attack whenever an attack is made.

Did the rule committee state that twin attack and twin blaster are mechanically the same SA for the purpose of interactions and stacking? After reading this thread and twin blaster, as written, it seems like the first replace attack use of twin blaster should trigger rend (it's two "normal"attacks, as in, no reference to "extra attack"), as opposed to rend triggering on the first attack of the second use of twin blaster when using it twice through weapon expert (as in, attacks #1 and #3).
gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Friday, August 30, 2024 2:47:19 PM
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It's in the glossary of one of the versions (and works that way because otherwise Twin Blaster would stack with Twin Attack).
FlyingArrow
Posted: Saturday, August 31, 2024 12:04:13 PM
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Glossary:
"Instead of making its normal attack or attacks, this character can make two attacks against a single enemy target in line of sight, ignoring the Melee Attack restriction, at the specified Attack value, dealing 10 Damage. This counts as a nonmelee attack for purposes of effects such as Lightsaber Deflect and Molecular Shielding. Twin Attack does not stack with this ability, and the second attack is resolved using the same rules as Twin Attack."

http://www.bloomilk.com/SpecialAbility?Id=466

That goes back to Vset 1: Destiny of the Force.
adamb0nd
Posted: Saturday, August 31, 2024 5:01:14 PM
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There it is, thanks
Lightsaber
Posted: Sunday, September 1, 2024 1:17:52 PM
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Thanks all! Might even run Trandoshans for VassalCon!
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