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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/26/2008 Posts: 937 Location: Phiadelphia, PA
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Ok, Simple Poll, Should We Leave The Rating System As Is For Squads. Or Would We Like These Idea's Listed Here Better?
Idea #1 - When Leaving A Rating On A Squad You Must Leave A Comment Also Or You Will Not Be Able To Leave A Rating.
Idea #2 - If You Do Leave A 1 Rating On A Squad & Your Comment Is Blank, Then A User Has The Option To Block You From Looking At His/Her Squads. Also Stopping Fighting & Bickering On Squad Comment Pages As Well.
Idea #3 - It Is Suggested That Is Ideas #1 & #2 Were To Put In Action That The Rating System For Squads being Rated Would Slow Down Leaving Alot Of Ratings & Comments Not Taking Place. Maybe Then Make A System To If You Like A Squad A User Made, You Can Subscribe To That User Being Alerted Or Pmed Whenever They Make A Squad Which I Think Would Balance The Issue Of Not Having Alot Of Ratings Anymore.
Thank You For Your Votes & Taking Interested In This Subject. Also Idea's & Other Things On This Problem Are Welcome. Your Idea Is Very Well Needed & Im Sure Everyone Would Love To Hear It.
Thank You People
-Bobby Pirrone (Darth Percocet)
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Rank: Quarren Assassin Groups: Member
Joined: 4/11/2009 Posts: 12
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I for 1 would love to see something done, And if these are the only idea's we have they arent so bad so i say go with them. I hate the 1 rating with no comment situation as well.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/26/2008 Posts: 937 Location: Phiadelphia, PA
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also people, if you wanna vote for not liking these idea's or any other answer.. i encourage you to vote for what you feel.. no hard feelings, no bitterness. This is a poll to see what everyone feels on this thats all..
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Rank: Grand Master Yoda Groups: Member
Joined: 9/13/2008 Posts: 508
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Get a petition to end GOWK threads and using multiple usernames (you KNOW who you are) to bump up one's squads and I will get behind it.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/26/2009 Posts: 272
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I personally haven't dealt with these issues, but if others feel this is a rampant problem then I will support you all on ending it.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/6/2008 Posts: 269 Location: I Caught the bloody whale.
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joelker41 wrote:Get a petition to end GOWK threads and using multiple usernames (you KNOW who you are) to bump up one's squads and I will get behind it. Well, with the new feature of showing who has logged on from different computers it can be misleading, because it says strate_jakit and i have logged on from the same one, but that is becase when we are hanging out i will sometimes check my BM's on his computer and vice-versa. Also consider sibbilings, parents, and their children might log on from the same computer. So dont just assume who has multiple accounts. Now im sure that there are some cases in which there are users with multiple accounts, but due to the reasons above we cant really know who has multiple accounts, and who has multiple people using the same computer.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/26/2008 Posts: 937 Location: Phiadelphia, PA
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yea, well with me i have a nephew that lives with me who goes on here, i have another nephew who comes on weekends, who goes on here.. i hjave my brother who comes down & when he does comes on here (Darth Babylon).. so in that sense i dont know any of my nephews passwords or my brothers& they dont know mine.. basically just because people go on one cpu for mutiple accounts doesnt mean they are all conspiring to drop great ratings for squads.. A good way to tell about mutiple accounts by one person is if they have trades done on there main account & none on the made up ones, for example if you look under mine & my 2 nephews we all got trades under our belts.. so it wouldnt make sense to get them GTL when i would just for myself. So thats one way.. i still like these idea's as what i would call the best ive seen so far.. not saying there isnt better out there.. i just like these ones so far.. Id rather deal with mutiple account users than the dudes dropping 1's cuz of bordism ya know..
on a side not i didnt know you could check whos using what cpu.. can anyone tell me how to check stuff like that i have a few suspicians about some things id like to check thanx people..
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Rank: Hailfire Droid Groups: Member
Joined: 1/8/2009 Posts: 34
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As far as ratings go its kinda lame I have gotten random 2s and 3s as well... I don't really want a pat on the back for what I build but a reason for ratings and why they think it wouldn't work would be nice... But any feedback is nice...
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Rank: Hailfire Droid Groups: Member
Joined: 1/8/2009 Posts: 34
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So I'm for anything that gets me feedback... The more people thinking about the weakness a sqaud the better the build will end out...
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/25/2009 Posts: 75 Location: Kearney Nebraska
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I think it is funny that peeps have multiple accounts to drop and higher squad ratings. GET A LIFE THERE IS MORE TO LIFE THAN SQUAD RATINGS. In addition, Bloomilk's squad building page is a very good tool to teach yourself how to build better squads and exploiting it is giving in to the dark side. Ewoks beat the dark side, therefore; if you do cheat then you are so weak you will get beat by furry midgets. (I don't think dark jedi's score either all i have ever heard about is the jedi having kids.)
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/2/2008 Posts: 538 Location: GC, Missouri
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I am kind of wondering why anyone actually cares about the rating system. Does it really matter?
I am not saying this to be mean or funny. I just know that I have used bloomilk since day one for squads. I have seen people give Gencon Tourney winning squads a one and then give a build that includes a figure from the insert newest set mini here a ten just because they are excited to see a new mini put to use.
I just have quit using bloomilk to build squads. I love what Aaron has done here but I keep my squads on mini manager for a couple of reasons.
One of them being I just dont care anymore what others think about my squads.
Two I dont think people are very honest on here about rating the squads. I see one person who has posted in this thread had multiple accounts on gamers at one time. That multiple account thing turned into a ugly trading situation too.
Unfortunately I dont think the rating system brings out the best in the community.
Shoebox used to have a comments function on it. IT seemed ok.
But look what are you going to say when someone gives your squad a 1 and then says well that is crap or that sucks!!!!
Dont think it would happen??? Well it did on Shoebox and it would here. Unfortunately I have toned down what I have seen really posted there. I hope you guys come up with a decent solution.
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Rank: Administration Groups: Administration
Joined: 10/2/2008 Posts: 351 Location: Kent, WA
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dnemiller wrote:I am kind of wondering why anyone actually cares about the rating system. Does it really matter?
I am not saying this to be mean or funny. I just know that I have used bloomilk since day one for squads. I have seen people give Gencon Tourney winning squads a one and then give a build that includes a figure from the insert newest set mini here a ten just because they are excited to see a new mini put to use.
I just have quit using bloomilk to build squads. I love what Aaron has done here but I keep my squads on mini manager for a couple of reasons.
One of them being I just dont care anymore what others think about my squads.
Two I dont think people are very honest on here about rating the squads. I see one person who has posted in this thread had multiple accounts on gamers at one time. That multiple account thing turned into a ugly trading situation too.
Unfortunately I dont think the rating system brings out the best in the community.
Shoebox used to have a comments function on it. IT seemed ok.
But look what are you going to say when someone gives your squad a 1 and then says well that is crap or that sucks!!!!
Dont think it would happen??? Well it did on Shoebox and it would here. Unfortunately I have toned down what I have seen really posted there. I hope you guys come up with a decent solution. Posts like this make me sad. You can use Bloo Milk to build squads, even if you aren't happy with the squad rating situation. Either don't make your squads public (so no one can rate them), or just make them public and ignore the bad ratings (and laugh at the good ratings, when a squad doesn't deserve them). There is a big benefit to having everyone post their squads to a community site like Bloo Milk. People may have just acquired Boba Fett, Mercenary or Mandalore the Ultimate or whatever and they want to see what kind of squads other people have built with these minis. A new player may want to know what kind of squads he can build in the Sith faction. Making your squads public allows people to find them in the Squad Search. It also affects the Character Usage page, which a lot of new players have told me they use to determine what pieces they should buy at first. Also, it bothers me when good players and squad builders like yourself, Dean, say that the rating system doesn't matter. If everyone who is knowledgeable enough to actually rate squads accurately stops rating, then it is a self-fulfulling prophecy. All that is left are new players who rate squads based on how much they like a certain character, and players who are just rating their squads 10s and other squads 1s.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 1/30/2009 Posts: 6,457 Location: Southern Illinois
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shinja wrote: There is a big benefit to having everyone post their squads to a community site like Bloo Milk. People may have just acquired Boba Fett, Mercenary or Mandalore the Ultimate or whatever and they want to see what kind of squads other people have built with these minis. A new player may want to know what kind of squads he can build in the Sith faction. Making your squads public allows people to find them in the Squad Search. It also affects the Character Usage page, which a lot of new players have told me they use to determine what pieces they should buy at first.
I see the above as the most important thing. New players need plenty of examples (good and not) to help them learn squad building. I don't have too many public squads posted at this point, mostly because I have concentrated on trading since I came here. If I really want feedback/suggestions for a particular squad I will post a link and request comments in this forum. I don't really care (for myself) about ratings, but I do agree that ratings and critique from good players is very helpful to those who wish to take their skills to a higher level. So with that in mind, I support any solutions that will improve the ratings situation, even though it won't affect my usage of the system at this time. I do think being required to leave a comment along with a rating should be implemented.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/4/2008 Posts: 1,441
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shinja wrote:Also, it bothers me when good players and squad builders like yourself, Dean, say that the rating system doesn't matter. If everyone who is knowledgeable enough to actually rate squads accurately stops rating, then it is a self-fulfulling prophecy. All that is left are new players who rate squads based on how much they like a certain character, and players who are just rating their squads 10s and other squads 1s. Well, I stopped commenting specifically when I rate a squad low in many cases, specifically because I tired of the complaining, the flame wars, and being reported to Shinja for it :) That's why if I give you a 1, you will rarely know it was me any more, because as a community, we are not mature enough to deal with accurate ratings. I don't believe the rating system matters one bit to me either. That may be sad, but it's none the less true. My single rating doesn't do enough to counter all of the poor ones done before or after me, so I have little reason to rate most squads. I also was a victim of more 1s than probably anyone on here, so again, I see little reason to seriously even rate my own squads. I pretty much give them all 10s now, to offset at least one of the 1s I am sure to get within minutes of posting a public squad, after that, it's out of my control. I look at the list of squads on the top 5 at any given time, and I cringe at 4 of them at least in most cases, even sometimes when it's been one of my own. I don't think this community as a whole understands how to rate squads, and certainly do not rate based on the same criteria. Shoebox's worked better, and had less cringing, because the only ratings it took into account were when people tagged your squad as one of their favorites. Squads with the most tags made the top 5. Generally, I only had to cringe at about 1 of the 5 on average, and usually that one was some kind of unique gimmick, or hate squad that people really liked at the time anyway, so I could live with it. Oddly, that system produced much better top squads than this one. Ways to help going forward. 1. To start with, I think a list of criteria should be posted as a sticky on the forums. Give people guidelines on what to rate squads based on. Most people want to be honest, and if most of us were rating based on the same things, then that would help eleviate the issues. As it is now, I might give a squad a 1 because I based it on say "competitive play" and others might give it a 10 because they liked that it used Niem Numb. It doesn't matter what the categories are, just some consistency would help. 2. Consider adding a button to the squad creation link, that allows a squad to be considered for rating in two or more categories - for lack of better ideas - Competitive and Casual. That way, if you think your new way to use Maul is the best use of Maul out there, you can be rated against other similar squads, instead of actual competitive top level squads. 3. Someway to deal with repeat squads, and this one I don't know what the answer is. It isn't a race to make a squad, and very few times are people actually stealing an idea from someone else. In general, the person who makes a squad well known based on play, or discussion is more important to the community than some guy who made an unnoticed squad months ago that he/she never even played, or worse, played once locally and went 1-2. So I am not in favor of anything having to do with who posted it first. But we also shouldn't have 2-3 of the same squad on the top of each list either. Perhaps some kind of rating link, that if you rate one, the other one gets the same rating, but even then, that doesn't deal with actual net deckers, or people who make a very similar squad with one piece different, nor with who gets "credit". Maybe something like a "view similar" button on all squads, that links squads that are very similar to it, and the rater can decide for themselves which one deserves the highest rating. I mean a very funny comparison right now, is my Dooku 150 squad and Fingersandteeth's. His is rated higher, but both are on the 150 list. Neither should be on there, even if GOWK were still legal. But in his description, he even writes, "Bill's squad with Lobot added". Yet for quite a while, people were rating his high, and mine low. 4. Perhaps a less numbers based system and instead something like: Recommended, Not Recommended, Ambivelent - as the categories one gets to choose. And then the top 5 list is made from a points system of like 5ps for Recommended, 0 for Ambivalent, and -3 for a Not recommended. Something like that.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/4/2008 Posts: 1,441
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swinefeld wrote:
I do think being required to leave a comment along with a rating should be implemented.
All that will do is stop the top level players like me from rating you at all. And the kiddies will rate you still with a comment like .............. or whatever the minimum requirements become. I have already been harassed and reported to Shinja several times for rating people with a 1-4 and telling them why. Sorry, people aren't here for real ratings in most cases, including several of those who have spoke in this thread.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 1/30/2009 Posts: 6,457 Location: Southern Illinois
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billiv15 wrote:swinefeld wrote:
I do think being required to leave a comment along with a rating should be implemented.
All that will do is stop the top level players like me from rating you at all. And the kiddies will rate you still with a comment like .............. or whatever the minimum requirements become. I have already been harassed and reported to Shinja several times for rating people with a 1-4 and telling them why. Sorry, people aren't here for real ratings in most cases, including several of those who have spoke in this thread. Well, I don't see there being any bullet-proof solution. If I rated low and left a comment as to why, and then got flamed in the comments to follow, I wouldn't necessarily feel obligated to respond to that. Now if these users are following you around the site and being pests, you should be reporting them. As to them reporting you for making legitimate comments/ratings, I would be shocked if any action was being taken against you by the site operator(s) as a result. (this ain't WotC ) If you don't feel it is worth it to spend your time ratings squads because of crap like that, then don't. I wouldn't blame you one bit. As to the kiddies typing ".........." or something like that - perhaps if the comment ALSO showed the rating that was left, now we would easily know who the culprits are. Doesn't stop them, but they lose anonymity, and gain exposure which could resulted in them being reported for abusing the system.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/2/2008 Posts: 538 Location: GC, Missouri
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shinja wrote:
Posts like this make me sad.
You can use Bloo Milk to build squads, even if you aren't happy with the squad rating situation. Either don't make your squads public (so no one can rate them), or just make them public and ignore the bad ratings (and laugh at the good ratings, when a squad doesn't deserve them).
There is a big benefit to having everyone post their squads to a community site like Bloo Milk. People may have just acquired Boba Fett, Mercenary or Mandalore the Ultimate or whatever and they want to see what kind of squads other people have built with these minis. A new player may want to know what kind of squads he can build in the Sith faction. Making your squads public allows people to find them in the Squad Search. It also affects the Character Usage page, which a lot of new players have told me they use to determine what pieces they should buy at first.
Also, it bothers me when good players and squad builders like yourself, Dean, say that the rating system doesn't matter. If everyone who is knowledgeable enough to actually rate squads accurately stops rating, then it is a self-fulfulling prophecy. All that is left are new players who rate squads based on how much they like a certain character, and players who are just rating their squads 10s and other squads 1s.
Well I was all into the whole squad thing at first Aaron. But after seeing the best concepts out there with a total rating of like a 3 or 4 it just got ridiculous. I understand your self fulfilling prophecy comment but really my one vote wont overcome twelve votes of 1. I tried for a while but it got old. I would love to see a solution but I honestly dont know what it would be. I also understand that it is good for newer players to see squads and find out what pieces they need to help them. I guess I get that point. My thing is I wish newer players would spend as much time learning to play the game (rules and tactics) as they do building squads. I think too much focus is put on building squads and too little is spent on things like tactical movement. But that is just me. If you guys come up with something better I will fully support it but as of right now it just seems like it is a bit boinked.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/10/2008 Posts: 184 Location: Middle of an Albertan field
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I like the idea of using "Like" "Dislike" or something along the lines of "Meh" instead of number ratiings. And maybe average the three to find how "liked" a squad is, based on number of an option and ratio to the other options.
The fact is, some squads deserve a 1, and others, though few, deserve 10's. If you get ones on good squads, shrug it off, it makes little difference on the actual playability of a squad. Giving yourself 10's doesn't help either, because you can delude yourself into thinking it actually is a perfect squad. In lieu of or until a change os made, just take it all in stride. Smile at the highs, consider the lows, and remember its a competetive game that needs competitive squads.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/7/2008 Posts: 396
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I never make my squads public because all of mine are scenario or casual squads that lack things such as door control. It is pointless to make them public in a competitive rating arena when my squads are not meant to be competetive. This is one of the reasons I will not play DCI, I cannot bring myself to mix eras. I store my Imperial Knights with my New Republic, for example. I like the idea of being able to ban someone who gives you a low rating and does not explain. But, as billiv15 said, it is often pointless to argue and many would abuse the power. I agree that something should be done, but I do not see a solution that will actually change anything, unfortunately.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/9/2009 Posts: 936 Location: Southern Illinois
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I don't personally rate squads because as I have said many times over I would not consider myself that great of a player to judge another person's squad. I have, however, said I thought a rating/comment tie in should be put into place. In fact I think the comment should reflect the rating so it is known what a person rated it. I think anonymous ratings only lead to dishonesty in the system. If it is obvious someone rated a squad with a motive other than to do an honest rating then allow these to be reported and removed. If you get yours removed too often have their rating ability blocked on their account.
I have used the rating system to look up squads to give me ideas for tourneys but found it a waste of time sorting through the bad ratings to find a squad worth looking at. I found myself looking at all the squads ignoring the rating altogether.
I for one keep my squads on SWM Minimanager. It is handy for me because I can send the files to friends for them to preview or throw it on a flashdrive to take with me wherever I go. I am hesitant to put them into any online program because if a site goes poof all my ideas go with it. Keeping a copy here and on SWMM is just redundant for me unless I want some critique to weed out my ideas on my squads.
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