BTW, whatever became of this community designed Sarlaac I keep hearing about but never seeing?

^Yeah, I know (I've heard that before), that's why I don't really hope for or expect it to happen (I just say that it would be hugely gratifying if something like this did work, for all customs designers involved, as it would be if any of my concepts on characters, abilities or ideas inspired a v-set piece in some form. That said, though, being noticed by designers is not my motive for designing customs -if it was, I would cost them more aggressively -).

And what is that about Gen Con? The winner is allowed to design a piece or something?

Ok, that's what I figured, as I had seen a few pieces with flavor texts 'designed by [....] Gen Con Winner' (I noticed it first on your Kyle. Are you on the design team period at this point though?).




And I assumed that part already

So these unidentified people don't love the game enough to play it and be involved, and yet you're saying that it's "the game they love so much." Confusing. Which one is it? Please pick one, and we can continue the conversation.


I don't pretent to speak for the rest of the people involved, but I will respond with some of my own thoughts and perspectives, since this question seems to come up in various ways every once in a while.

As Deri said, this thing is a headless monster. That is, we have no specific or identified leader (or group of leaders). When the game was in production, this was easy: the head was WotC. After WotC walked out, there were different people in the community who stepped up in various ways to keep things moving. Among them were some people who stepped into the design/production role. That's how this headless monster evolved.

Designing is a tricky role, because the fact of the matter is that it would simply not be wise to let just anyone design the official pieces of a game. For example, you don't want just anyone to do brain surgery on your child or your best friend; some people will do a fabulous job, and others will probably try hard and have good intentions, but the results just won't be what you need. Therefore, a deep and well-nuanced understanding of the game and the competitive meta is and has always been one of the main criteria in deciding who will be the designers in a given set.

Now fast forward a few sets, and we've got a core of something like 12-15 designers who have already established that they can do an excellent job. We have more than enough designers, and there are generally only 4 design slots per set. We really don't need new designers, as we once did. However, Deri and others have mentioned adding 1 new designer per set (TimmerB is the new guy in Set 7, for example), so there IS room for new designers. There are also issues of continuity, focus, and direction that are important to maintain in the V-Sets. And don't forget matters of personality: there is a LOT of work that goes into designing a V-Set, and you really don't want to be working with difficult people throughout that long process. If someone is consistently negative or if their play group tends to cause a lot of problems, then I think it makes sense that they're not going to be high on the list of potential new designers.

Now, once again, please recognize that I am only speaking from my own perspective. I'm sure that other people would give different answers, with different emphases. But rather than ignore your question, I figured it was better to at least give a start to answering your question.

Back to work now....

Ummmmm....

To answer the first about about love of the game, What it means is that of course they love the game and most likely they will just begin banning, altering, designing their own pieces and walk away from the communitty. Come people have no problem with this and say, just let the walk, I am against that idea personally and would like to see whatever core the game has dissolved to stay around.

To the rest of this I fail to see how you could incorporate new designers but not need them, please choose one or the other :) little stab there, but seriously, I still don't understand why the designers can't rotate to playtesting and bring in more new playtesters as designers. Obviously a new designer would not head the set or anything, but have someone like Deri head a set with another proven designer with 2 new people for some new ideas and maybe different directions things could go. Your post makes it sound like there is a set core of people that should and do get to decide every aspect of the game going forward, and that works great for a company that is producing something, but when you are relying on volunteer work, opening it up some should only serve to help strengthen everyone's resolve to make the game better, funner, and stronger.

As far as negative play groups not being considered for a head spot or whatever, I can only assume you are directly referring to the TN playgroup, which is kind of sad to me because I know that I, personally, have ruffled some feathers, but I know for a fact that some of the best playtests and playtesters have come from this playgroup, heck I bet if you went back to set 6 I probably turned in more, what I consider, quality play reports then anyone, maybe that guy from New Zealand... Mando something turned in more, but I know I was up there. But I also know that I could never be a designer, not political enough for it, but to pass on others from this play group because of MY actions is absurd.

I have actually done a lot of work for the v-sets, sorry if being vocal about things I have issues with has offended you so greatly. Refute my claim about play testing and prove me wrong. We may be vocal about things, but we also did A LOT for the game as well, take the vehicles, I play tested them religiously and even had them changed due to my playtests, If I remember the squad I put together had Daniel saying he was concerned about what it would do to the game. That being said Bronson went out of his way to be a great play tester, and helped on various pieces directly, and a lot of what he said and did was taken into consideration, but to not allow him to be a designer because you don't like me is just pathetic man.

Sorry to the rest of you I want to get this back on track now:
I disagree with the whole carrot thing, I am not saying that you should drag them along with prizes or rewards, I am saying that people SHOULD be rewarded for their hard work, regardless of what you consider it, it is practical, Daniel worked his way up by doing the work, and that option should be open to EVERYONE that puts forth the work, knowledge, and aptitude to do it.

The community is small enough now that if you post just one name and everyone in your group says +1, there's probably about a 99% chance that piece will appear in the next Vset. Of course, if you post 100 names of pieces, and you don't have agreement in your group then it won't work.

not even what I am talking about, while I know you guys take from the list, I have seen it posted first hand n the design threads, "Hey this many people want this so let drop this and add this.", which is cool, this topic goes beyond that and goes into the actual input process. People don't jus want a piece they have certain expectations for a piece and if the community had more input on it, I just don't see how that could do anything but help keep the small community left alive and engaged.

Not enough hours in the day