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The Jedi Exile, ??? (TN Minis, Set II Community piece!) Options
pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 7:33:44 AM
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That's 150 points for one damage dealer and the two pullers in question. And the filler has to be Force users, too. Nomi limits the squad, so you have to take that into account with anything that could be powerful. Yes, they have to target her if adjacent and she has LS Defense. The Exile can also spend 2 to defend her etc., but that takes all the 'problematic' extra Pulls out of the equation. You don't really want 3 people having to hit Nomi lol.

This is all, of course, still banking on the idea that the opponent leaves 3 of his (or her) hard hitters there for you to pull to Nomi. Since the Exile is having to do 2 of the Pulls with her limited Force points (and of course that takes away from Throw Defense for Nomi), she will have two of the victims next to HER, thus usually only 1 could be next to Nomi, if that, besides the one that Nomi pulled. Teeing up 2 or 3 targets for Revan (especially 'hard hitters' as you listed) in this manner is in no way ideal, nor a tactic to really build a squad around at 150. Revan will likely not get Cunning usually in this scenario either.

As I said before, there probably IS some things that need to be considered before putting something like this out, and of course it needs testing. Thus far, though, I have not really seen anything abusable about it.
pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 9:12:17 AM
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grievously pwned wrote:
This is my vote:

while i like the idea of force connection allowing her to gain a ofrce power that costs 2 or less, but she could also take force pull from Nomi, and being able to force pull 3 times a round in a squad would be to much imo.

Meetra Surik, Redeemed Jedi
Cost: 40

HP: 100
Def: 21
Att: 13
Dam: 20

Unique
Melee Attack
Double Attack
Light Tutor
Lightsaber Trainer
Force Connection (This character can spend allies' Force Points as though they were her own)
Adaptive Duelist (At the beginning of the skirmish, after setup, choose either Makashi Style or Soresu Style. This character gains that special ability until the end of the skirmish.)

Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Lightsaber Throw Defense (Force 2: When an ally within 6 squares is hit by an attack, that character takes no damage with a save of 11)
Force Heal 20
Force Abosrb


For reasons beyond the discussion of Force Pull, the head designers have decided that we are going to begin testing on this stat block (we may be able to make some more edits and such later). We'll keep you all posted on changes as they happen!

Thank you to everybody who has or will contribute to this stat blocks design! It looks awesome and should be very fun to play!
SignerJ
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:07:12 PM
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Playtesting-wise, I'd suggest using this piece with Nomi more than with Revan. Xe was designed partially with Nomi in mind (one of the reasons the Exile has Force Heal 20, a replaces attacks Force power), whereas Revan has virtually no synergy with xem.
Including a piece for the reason of being a Force battery for the Exile might be an interesting strategy, as well, in order to allow her to use Lightsaber Throw Defense more often.

And I'm also a bit curious about how strong a squad using her and Farfalla for protecting allies would be...
jen'ari
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:25:49 PM
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pegolego wrote:
That's 150 points for one damage dealer and the two pullers in question. And the filler has to be Force users, too. Nomi limits the squad, so you have to take that into account with anything that could be powerful. Yes, they have to target her if adjacent and she has LS Defense. The Exile can also spend 2 to defend her etc., but that takes all the 'problematic' extra Pulls out of the equation. You don't really want 3 people having to hit Nomi lol.

This is all, of course, still banking on the idea that the opponent leaves 3 of his (or her) hard hitters there for you to pull to Nomi. Since the Exile is having to do 2 of the Pulls with her limited Force points (and of course that takes away from Throw Defense for Nomi), she will have two of the victims next to HER, thus usually only 1 could be next to Nomi, if that, besides the one that Nomi pulled. Teeing up 2 or 3 targets for Revan (especially 'hard hitters' as you listed) in this manner is in no way ideal, nor a tactic to really build a squad around at 150. Revan will likely not get Cunning usually in this scenario either.

As I said before, there probably IS some things that need to be considered before putting something like this out, and of course it needs testing. Thus far, though, I have not really seen anything abusable about it.


Limited Force Points? she can use allies force points, ensuring that if you ever need a force pull you can, Nomi does not use many FP throughout the game.
If you move Exile two away from Nomi you can easily position all 3 to be adjacent to Nomi.
It does not matter because you will usually not have to force pull 3 because I have never really seen an army with 3 heavy hitters.
Force pull would be very very powerful, as would levitation
pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:38:02 PM
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Location: In a sinkhole on Utapau
jen'ari wrote:
pegolego wrote:
That's 150 points for one damage dealer and the two pullers in question. And the filler has to be Force users, too. Nomi limits the squad, so you have to take that into account with anything that could be powerful. Yes, they have to target her if adjacent and she has LS Defense. The Exile can also spend 2 to defend her etc., but that takes all the 'problematic' extra Pulls out of the equation. You don't really want 3 people having to hit Nomi lol.

This is all, of course, still banking on the idea that the opponent leaves 3 of his (or her) hard hitters there for you to pull to Nomi. Since the Exile is having to do 2 of the Pulls with her limited Force points (and of course that takes away from Throw Defense for Nomi), she will have two of the victims next to HER, thus usually only 1 could be next to Nomi, if that, besides the one that Nomi pulled. Teeing up 2 or 3 targets for Revan (especially 'hard hitters' as you listed) in this manner is in no way ideal, nor a tactic to really build a squad around at 150. Revan will likely not get Cunning usually in this scenario either.

As I said before, there probably IS some things that need to be considered before putting something like this out, and of course it needs testing. Thus far, though, I have not really seen anything abusable about it.


Limited Force Points? she can use allies force points, ensuring that if you ever need a force pull you can, Nomi does not use many FP throughout the game.
If you move Exile two away from Nomi you can easily position all 3 to be adjacent to Nomi.
It does not matter because you will usually not have to force pull 3 because I have never really seen an army with 3 heavy hitters.
Force pull would be very very powerful, as would levitation


Not when it was in question. NOW she gets lots of Force points, but the problem was when she could use allies Force POWERS or she couldn't have HAD Pull for there to be a discussion.

Also, you have to pull to the nearest available square, so that makes it a bit harder to get all of them next to Nomi.

But it's irrelevant now, the ability cannot share Powers and still be used on future pieces (thanks to SignerJ for suggesting the ability, by the way! BigGrin)
pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:41:48 PM
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SignerJ wrote:
Playtesting-wise, I'd suggest using this piece with Nomi more than with Revan. Xe was designed partially with Nomi in mind (one of the reasons the Exile has Force Heal 20, a replaces attacks Force power), whereas Revan has virtually no synergy with xem.
Including a piece for the reason of being a Force battery for the Exile might be an interesting strategy, as well, in order to allow her to use Lightsaber Throw Defense more often.

And I'm also a bit curious about how strong a squad using her and Farfalla for protecting allies would be...


A nasty idea, that. Then using Bastila to Squad Heal damage that does get through... A tanky squad, maybe not a lot of offense though.
obiwan1knight
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 3:57:50 PM
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Hey everyone, I've been kinda out of the loop here because of Thanksgiving and family, and I'm just wondering what the piece is looking like so far. Also, what is "xem"? is that the Exile?
jen'ari
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 4:07:18 PM
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pegolego wrote:


Not when it was in question.


When it was in question she could use the ally's force points that she took the FP from.
Which means she could use Nomi's Force points.

Where is the ruling that it has to be the closest square? I did not know that
pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 4:27:18 PM
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jen'ari wrote:
pegolego wrote:


Not when it was in question.


When it was in question she could use the ally's force points that she took the FP from.
Which means she could use Nomi's Force points.

Where is the ruling that it has to be the closest square? I did not know that


Yeah, they ruled it that you have to use the shortest path to get to the puller when all the talk about spamming circles around LIIN Mines came up.

Also,

sithbot wrote:
At the beginning of the skirmish choose an ally, this character gains one of the chosen allies Force powers that replaces attacks and costs 2 or less.
jen'ari
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 4:45:09 PM
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pegolego wrote:

Yeah, they ruled it that you have to use the shortest path to get to the puller when all the talk about spamming circles around LIIN Mines came up.

that is really good to know, when I have been playing Vassal by myself I have been using force pull differently, I think even against Deaths_Baine I played it differently
pegolego wrote:

Also,

At the beginning of the skirmish choose an ally, this character gains one of the chosen allies Force powers that replaces attacks and costs 2 or less.


Also,

You should post the whole quote. here it is.

sithbot wrote:

I think Force Connection should read:
At the beginning of the skirmish choose an ally, this character gains one of the chosen allies Force powers that replaces attacks and costs 2 or less.
This character can spend that allies Force Points as though they were her own.


pegolego
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 4:56:54 PM
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Location: In a sinkhole on Utapau
jen'ari wrote:
pegolego wrote:

Yeah, they ruled it that you have to use the shortest path to get to the puller when all the talk about spamming circles around LIIN Mines came up.

that is really good to know, when I have been playing Vassal by myself I have been using force pull differently, I think even against Deaths_Baine I played it differently
pegolego wrote:

Also,

At the beginning of the skirmish choose an ally, this character gains one of the chosen allies Force powers that replaces attacks and costs 2 or less.


Also,

You should post the whole quote. here it is.

sithbot wrote:

I think Force Connection should read:
At the beginning of the skirmish choose an ally, this character gains one of the chosen allies Force powers that replaces attacks and costs 2 or less.
This character can spend that allies Force Points as though they were her own.



I hadn't seen any post stating both at once lol, I was going on the ones that had it otherwise. EDIT: I see now, that was simply on the sentence directly below it, I had missed that, my bad. I had thought this whole time the discussion was Force powers between when it said Force points (which I had thought made more sense, I never noticed both were on there LOL). All my arguments were based on a version getting through sharing Powers, thus making Pull an issue, with Force Points as an alternative.

Despite that meaning 6 FPs a round going off 2 characters, that IS worse than what I was thinking.

Though that doesn't make 3 Pulls any more realistic (I still don't see why you would want to Pull more than one of your opponent's beat sticks in to your own one beatstick). It just means that if your opponent were to play really badly and the game lasted for several rounds without you using defensive abilities much if at all, you might pull 4 or 5 times.

If for some reason you needed to of course.

Anyway, the point is moot now, so need to discuss it furtherSmile. I can see where you are coming from, even if I don't agree with it.
SignerJ
Posted: Thursday, December 4, 2014 6:27:53 PM
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pegolego wrote:
But it's irrelevant now, the ability cannot share Powers and still be used on future pieces (thanks to SignerJ for suggesting the ability, by the way! BigGrin)


Quick note for whoever uploads the designs to BlooMilk: both Force Connection and Adaptive Duelist are already in the custom special ability database, so xe doesn't need to create new versions.
SithBot
Posted: Saturday, December 13, 2014 9:09:43 AM
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I propose the following CE:

Adjacent Unique Old Republic Allies can make 1 immediate attack when defeated
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 11:45:14 AM
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This is where to community piece stands as of right now just to give everyone an update:

Meetra Surik, Redeemed Jedi
Cost: 40

HP: 100
Def: 21
Att: 13
Dam: 20

Unique
Melee Attack
Double Attack
Lightsaber Trainer
Force Connection (This character can spend allies' Force Points as though they were her own)
Adaptive Duelist (At the beginning of the skirmish, after setup, choose either Makashi Style or Soresu Style. This character gains that special ability until the end of the skirmish.)

Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Lightsaber Throw Defense (Force 2: When an ally within 6 squares is hit by an attack, that character takes no damage with a save of 11)
Force Heal 20
Lightsaber Throw 1
SignerJ
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 3:28:03 PM
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Posts: 746
Lightsaber Throw 1 was a nice call. Kudos to whoever thought of that.
Deaths_Baine
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 7:52:05 PM
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Joined: 5/31/2010
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I think the piece is coming along pretty well. the one issue I am having with its current form is that I can spend force points from things such as younglings. and it needs to have a tag added to it that says it cannot combine force points from itself with force points from others.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 8:20:51 PM
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Posts: 8,428
pegolego wrote:

Yeah, they ruled it that you have to use the shortest path to get to the puller when all the talk about spamming circles around LIIN Mines came up.



You don't have to go to the nearest spot, but whatever spot you choose, you have to use a shortest path.
SignerJ
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 8:24:27 PM
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Deaths_Baine wrote:
I think the piece is coming along pretty well. the one issue I am having with its current form is that I can spend force points from things such as younglings. and it needs to have a tag added to it that says it cannot combine force points from itself with force points from others.


I'll add the combining Force points bit. I don't have any issues with her using Younglings, but that's up to the others.
CorellianComedian
Posted: Saturday, December 20, 2014 8:55:04 PM
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Joined: 8/30/2014
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Deaths_Baine wrote:
I think the piece is coming along pretty well. the one issue I am having with its current form is that I can spend force points from things such as younglings. and it needs to have a tag added to it that says it cannot combine force points from itself with force points from others.


Would using Younglings as Force batteries be all that bad? As far as I know, OR doesn't have access to any Force Renewal CEs. That would mean that you would be basically 'buying' Force points for 5 points a piece - which doesn't sound like that great of a deal to me, but I'm not very familiar with strategies like that. But I could be missing something, and if so, I would very much like to be informed of what it is.

On a side note, who makes the save for Lightsaber Defense Throw: the Exile, or the target ally?
theultrastar
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2014 6:01:23 AM
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The Exile does
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