|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Wow, I swear the randomiser is listening sometimes..... Darth Revan, Sith Lord, from Destiny of the Force (although if you're cheap like me, you can just use a Jensaarai Defender instead): Quote:62 points, Sith Hit Points: 130 Defense: 22 Attack: 14 Damage: 20
Special Abilities Unique Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Cunning Attack (+4 Attack and +10 Damage against an enemy who has not activated this round) Master Tactician (You automatically choose who goes first except on a roll of 1)
Force Powers Force 2 Force Renewal 1 (This character gets 1 Force point each time he activates) Master of the Force 2 (May spend Force points up to 2 times in a single turn) Master Speed (Force 1: This character can move 6 extra squares on his turn as part of his move) Lightsaber Defense (Force 1: When hit by an attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11) Lightsaber Assault (Force 1, replaces attacks: Make 2 attacks)
Commander Effect At the end of this character's turn, he may exchange positions with another ally of the same base size within 6 squares. As we saw a few pages ago, the original WOTC Revan was a jumbly, overcosted mess and this remake, which came out in the first v-set, is a vast improvement. He carries on the flavour of the first with a similar statline, Master Tactician, and a movement breaker, but his movement breaker is much more significant. The Sith have always had to deal with being outactivated, and Revan helps them get around this by introducing a single phase swap. With Master Speed, he can run 18 squares (or 12 squares if he wants to attack as well), and swap another piece in his place. This means that the Sith can use their swap anytime in the round - most other swap builds prefer to swap after their opponent is all done, since they need 3 activations before the swapped piece can attack anything. Revan's most successful pairing is with Lord Kaan - he can set up the "Kaan bomb" where he swaps Lord Kaan in and Kaan explodes in the middle of the opponent's squad. As well as swap, Revan's also a good cleanup attacker with Cunning +10 and Lightsaber Assault, he's sturdy with 22 defense, 130 hit points, and lightsaber defense, and Master Tactician gives Sith initiative control. If I remember correctly, every Regional winning Sith squad has been built around the two movement breakers they've received in the v-sets - either this Revan, or Darth Caedus, Sith Lord. This squad won two Regionals in the same day in 2012, after the Sith had never previously won a Regional: Quote:--'JAQ'ed up!-- 62 Darth Revan, Sith Lord 36 Atton "Jaq" Rand 36 Lord Kaan 27 Lobot 16 Grand Admiral Rulf Yage 14 Exar Kun, Dark Force Spirit 6 Mouse Droid x2 3 Rodian Brute (200pts. 9 activations) Darth Revan Sith Lord is a great piece, and he deserves an 11 - he is a power piece that you build around in Sith, and he brings initiative control and a great movement breaker, two very important abilities in this game, to the table. I do have reservations - at 62 points he is a big chunk of your squad, and he's far more expensive than any other power 11 piece we've covered so far. But he's a great rendition of Revan, and a cornerstone for some competitive Sith builds, and squeaks into an 11/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/29/2008 Posts: 1,786 Location: Canada
|
I absolutely LOVE this piece! One of the best and most creative designs ever, IMHO.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/9/2008 Posts: 4,729 Location: Chicago
|
thereisnotry wrote:I absolutely LOVE this piece! One of the best and most creative designs ever, IMHO. +1 Faction defining piece. And the fact that he's 62 points and you can say that is huge. I always felt 11 meant undercosted and overpowered. In that sense I'd give him a perfect 10. He's top tier competitive, yet still balanced. His one phase swap was a stroke of genius. Still one of the best DESIGNED pieces ever.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
I was tossing up between a 10 and 11. On one hand he's really not undercosted at all, he could even be a few points cheaper and not be broken. But the stuff he brings to the table is so good (most good movement breakers are getting 11s, and initiative control is very important as well), and he's a faction defining piece. I think he's the weakest 11 so far, but an 11 nonetheless.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Lando Calrissian, Dashing Scoundrel, from Alliance and Empire Quote:18 points, Fringe Hit Points: 50 Defense: 17 Attack: 8 Damage: 20
Special Abilities Unique Evade (When hit by an attack from a nonadjacent enemy, this character takes no damage with a save of 11) Mobile Attack (Can move both before and after attacking) Opportunist (+4 Attack and +10 Damage against an enemy who has activated this round) It's interesting to look at the uber positive comments on Lando's page - upon release he would have been a competitive option as an efficient mid-range Opportunist shooter. With Mobile he can take safe shots, with Opportunist he's hitting for 30 damage at +12, and with evade and 50 hit points, he has some ranged survivability. He's a solid piece, but with the advent of Dash Rendar, Renegade Smuggler, who costs only an additional 10 points, has 20 extra hit points, and who can put out 80 damage at +10 with Opportunist, Lando's going to struggle to get play as the Opportunist shooter in a 200 point squad. Lando DS has a few chances of seeing play - he might be worth keeping in your Lobot reinforcements box if you come up against a low activation squad and just want another attacker, and if you're playing a living Sep squad based around Whorm's twin, he might be an option too. In the scheme of things, Lando's a fairly solid piece - he just happens to fill the same niche as the undercosted and adaptable Dash Renegade Smuggler, so he he'll struggle to see much table time. 7/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/29/2008 Posts: 1,786 Location: Canada
|
Lando DS was used all the time back when he first came out. He was a superb piece then, probably rating about a 9/10 at the time. But then you're right: Dash came along just about a year later, and the mobile-quad shooters have replaced pieces like Lando ever since. However, even after Dash/Cad/Rex, Lando was still often used in peoples' Fringe Reinforcements box...for a long time, it was hard to do better than him for 18pts.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Gamorrean Bodyguard, from Masters of the Force Quote:13 points, Fringe Hit Points: 50 Defense: 13 Attack: 4 Damage: 20
Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Mighty Swing (On his turn, if this character doesn't move, he gets +10 Damage against adjacent enemies) Bodyguard (If an adjacent ally would take damage from an attack, this character can take the damage instead) Bodyguard's a really strong Special Ability, and a 50 hit point bodyguard for 13 points is a great deal. The Gamorrean is largely competing with other bodyguards in the same price range - assuming you're using Lobot, and you want a bodyguard as a reinforcement: - Twi'lek Bodyguard has 30 hit points, can't shoot, and you can bring in 2 of them. - the Human Bodyguard has 40 hit points, can shoot (badly) and combine fire, and you can bring in 3 additional activations. - the Gamorrean has 50 hit points, can't shoot, and you can bring in 2 additional activations. - Ponda Baba, GC, has 60 hit points, can shoot quite well, and you can bring in 1 additional activation. All these 4 Fringe bodyguards are viable - it's worth having all of them in your Lobot box. The Gamorrean is constrained by its melee attack, since it's often good to have your bodyguard combining fire so it's doing something useful. But if you're playing a melee based squad and don't need to combine fire, he's a good choice - he can take 3 20 damage hits for one of your important pieces, which can often be game-changing. The Gamorrean Bodyguard is a useful piece to have - often the shooting bodyguards are stronger options, but he's still a handy reinforcement option, 8/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 9/30/2008 Posts: 1,288
|
In 2010 I would bring an R7 and a Gamorrean Bodyguard in with Reinforcements every time I played against Yobuck. The 50 HP Bodyguard let me run a formation of all my important pieces with him at the center and he could take 3 gallops, and I would give out AoOs while it happened. Madine would also be on the group so he had to end more than 6ish squares away before stopping or he would be trapped and killed. It worked really well, partly because the mentality of most Yobuck players is to try to start getting good gallops early, but there was really no way for them to do so against me. If give him an 8/10. He's competing with other Bodyguards, but he's definitely one of the better options.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/30/2009 Posts: 1,389 Location: New Zealand ( kind of by Australia)
|
TheHutts wrote:Gamorrean Bodyguard, from Masters of the Force
- the Human Bodyguard has 40 hit points, can shoot (badly) Try telling that to Aaron.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Echo24 wrote:In 2010 I would bring an R7 and a Gamorrean Bodyguard in with Reinforcements every time I played against Yobuck. The 50 HP Bodyguard let me run a formation of all my important pieces with him at the center and he could take 3 gallops, and I would give out AoOs while it happened. Madine would also be on the group so he had to end more than 6ish squares away before stopping or he would be trapped and killed. It worked really well, partly because the mentality of most Yobuck players is to try to start getting good gallops early, but there was really no way for them to do so against me. If give him an 8/10. He's competing with other Bodyguards, but he's definitely one of the better options. It's actually pretty hard to draw a line between the four bodyguards above - maybe they should all be 8s? They are all fairly solid, and fairly costed in relation to each other. Twi'lek is maybe the weakest for it's cost, but it's still good because you can have two (or bring in a Twi'lek and a Human Force Adept against Mace).
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Luke Skywalker, Force Spirit, from Legacy of the Force Quote:10 points, New Republic Hit Points: -- Defense: -- Attack: -- Damage: --
Special Abilities Unique Light Spirit (Ignores characters and terrain. Cannot open doors. Cannot attack or be damaged, and does not count as a legal target, the nearest enemy, or adjacent. Not subject to commander effects. Does not provide cover. At the start of the skirmish, choose a Unique allied character with a Force rating. That ally gains Force Renewal 1 and Mettle while within 4 squares of this character. This character is defeated if the chosen ally is defeated. An enemy within 6 squares can spend 1 Force point to defeat this character; save 11. This effect replaces that enemy's attacks.) Speed 4 (Can move only 4 squares and attack, or 8 squares without attacking) As we saw on page 25, Obi-Wan Kenobi, Jedi Spirit is a really good piece, and Luke FS is the New Republic equivalent - for two extra points you get an upgrade from Speed 2 to Speed 4. He doesn't seem to have found his way into as many top tier builds as Obi has, however; one reason for this may be that New Republic builds are tighter for points, and paying 10 points for force renewal for a single piece is a luxury that many competitive builds can't afford. There are plenty of really good pieces that benefit from force renewal though - if you're playing any of these, Luke can be beneficial. - Kyle Katarn Jedi Battlemaster - Kyp Durron - Mara Jade, Smuggler - Barriss Offee, Rogue Jedi - Kyle Katarn (with Jan Ors) - Zekk - Jacen Solo, Jedi Knight - Saba Sebatyne - Jaina Solo, Sword of the Jedi - Kyp Durron, Jedi Master IMO, Luke FS is just short of the top tier competitive scene in 2014 - but he's a really good piece to have on hand, as he helps out lots of builds that are just below the top tier. I like playing round with New Republic builds outside tournament play, and my Luke FS gets plenty of use, 7/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Destroyer Droid, from Clone Strike Quote:30 points, Separatist Hit Points: 40 Defense: 16 Attack: 8 Damage: 20
Special Abilities Droid (Immune to critical hits; not subject to commander effects) Double Attack (On its turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Shields 2 (When this character takes damage, make 2 saves, each needing 11; each success reduces the damage dealt by 10) Wheel Form (This character can move up to 18 squares if it does not attack) The Destroyer Droid is a neat design that got left behind by the ravages of power creep. Wheel Form, Shields 2, and Double Attack are perfect Special Ability choices for this piece, and with help from the Battle Droid Officer and Whorm/GGDAC, it's potentially a potent attacker with double/twin at +12 or +16. Its main problem is just that 40 hit points isn't enough to keep it safe, even with Shields 2, it's going to have to sit out in the open to take its attacks, and like most of the Sep droids, it fails the IG-86 test - most players would opt for two IG-86s over it. The first v-set, Destiny of the Force, released a very faithful remake - the stats and abilities are very similar, and it mainly just gains some extra robustness for 7 extra points, to bring it up to standard for the modern game. The Destroyer Droid is a really good design, it's just been left behind by the rising damage ceiling in the game. Interestingly, this piece has two different sculpts, both released as Rares; the Clone Strike one (pictured), is far more expensive and popular, due to the pose in the sculpt. 5/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Carth Onasi, from Knights of the Old Republic Quote:37 points, Old Republic Hit Points: 70 Defense: 16 Attack: 7 Damage: 10
Special Abilities Unique Pilot Deadeye (On this character's turn, if he doesn't move, he gets +10 Damage) Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Industrial Repair 10 (Replaces attacks: touch; remove 10 damage from 1 character with Mounted Weapon) Intuition (Once per round, after initiative is determined, this character can immediately move up to his speed before any other character activates) Twin Attack (Whenever this character attacks, he makes 1 extra attack against the same target) It's fair to say that Carth is one of the most useless uniques in the game, especially given that he came out in one of the later WOTC sets. With only 10 base damage and 7 attack, he's not going to cause big pieces any problems, unless he has a lot of support, and since he's already 37 points, there are much cheaper options to build around. Double/twin/intuition has some potential, but his attack and damage are so low that he's unusable. To add insult to injury, the next set came out with Captain Rex, who is blatantly superior (cheaper, an attack that's almost twice as high, base damage of 20, GMA, a good CE), and in a faction with better support. There's no good reason to play this piece, just use the much better v-set remake instead. 1/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/5/2009 Posts: 2,240 Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
|
Ouch! Wonder how much time they gave designers to make pieces?
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
Obi-Wan Kenobi, Padawan, from Knights of the Old Republic Quote:22 points, Republic Hit Points: 70 Defense: 17 Attack: 10 Damage: 20
Special Abilities Unique Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Ataru Style (+4 Attack if exactly 1 enemy is within 6 squares) Flurry Attack (Whenever this character scores a critical hit, he can make 1 immediate extra attack)
Force Powers Force 3 Lightsaber Assault (Force 1, replaces attacks: Make 2 attacks) He's another much maligned Unique from Knights of the Old Republic, but Obi-Wan Padawan is a whole lot better than Carth Onasi. He's not a terrible piece for 22 points, and maybe his biggest issue is that he's always going to suffer from inevitable comparisons to the Jedi Weapon Master - at 26 points, the Jedi Weapon Master has better stats and hit points than Obi-Wan Padawan, as well as Lightsaber Defense and Riposte. But while he is underwhelming in comparison to the JWM, that doesn't make Obi Padawan a terrible piece, and he arguably has a niche in swap squads where he can set up to use his Ataru Style and get his attack higher than a JWM. But like the two previous pieces on this thread, it's telling that Obi-Wan Padawan was remade very early in the v-sets, and the v-set version is much more cost effective and interesting, with some extra tricks. Obi-Wan Kenobi Padawan isn't an awful piece for the cost, but he's still unlikely to see any play in his WOTC form. 4/10.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
R7 Astromech Droid, from Galaxy at War Quote:8 points, Fringe Hit Points: 40 Defense: 16 Attack: 0 Damage: 0
Special Abilities Droid (Immune to critical hits; not subject to commander effects) Ion Shielding (Can ignore special abilities that affect only nonliving targets.) Override (At the end of its turn, this character can designate 1 door that it can see as open or closed; it remains open or closed until the end of this character's next turn, or until it is defeated)
Override is a crucial ability - if you don't have any door control, you're not going to win competitive games. And the R7 is a very efficient door control piece. With 16 defense, 40 hit points, and ion shielding (which stops it from getting picked off by Jawas), it's very robust for its cost. The R7 is an amazingly good piece that performs a vital role, is very competitively costed at 8 points, and it features in tournament squads frequently, 11/10.
|
|
Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
|
11/10.
It's so good it's chased away R2-D2, except for the Republic version.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
FlyingArrow wrote:11/10.
It's so good it's chased away R2-D2, except for the Republic version. Fair enough - I was definitely wavering between the 10 and 11, so I've gone up to 11. I have been wondering for a while what marks the cheap Fringe staples like Rodian Brutes, Mouse Droids, Ugnaught Demolitionists, and the R7 should get. They're all extremely efficient pieces that perform vital roles.
|
|
Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
, Moderator
Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
|
TheHutts wrote:FlyingArrow wrote:11/10.
It's so good it's chased away R2-D2, except for the Republic version. Fair enough - I was definitely wavering between the 10 and 11, so I've gone up to 11. I have been wondering for a while what marks the cheap Fringe staples like Rodian Brutes, Mouse Droids, Ugnaught Demolitionists, and the R7 should get. They're all extremely efficient pieces that perform vital roles. Mice and Ugnaughts are ubiquitous: 11/10. Rodian Brute is a 9 or 10 in my book. Fills its role quite well, but not every squad needs its role. 20-def Blockers (sometimes at 2 points) and door control are always useful.
|
|
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
|
General Grievous, Hero of Hypori, from Scum and Villainy Quote:42 points, Fringe Hit Points: 120 Defense: 21 Attack: 10 Damage: 20
Special Abilities Unique Cyborg (Counts as both a Droid and a non-Droid; living; subject to critical hits and commander effects) Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies) Double Attack (On his turn, this character can make 1 extra attack instead of moving) Twin Attack (Whenever this character attacks, he makes 1 extra attack against the same target) Jedi Hunter (+4 Attack and +10 Damage against enemies with Force ratings) Parry (When hit by a melee attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11) Spinning Blade Attack (Replaces turn, usable only while this character is at half Hit Points or more: This character can move up to his speed this turn and he can attack each adjacent enemy once as he moves. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity.) Wall Climber (This character ignores difficult terrain, enemy characters, low objects, and pits when moving as long as a square he occupies and a square he is moving into are adjacent to a wall)
Force Powers Force 1 The only other iterations of General Grievous that were designed as front line fighters, rather than as commanders, came out way back in the early days of SWM and were horribly dated, so this piece was well overdue. I really don't have anything bad to say about this guy - he's a great representation, he's a tough fighter with double, twin, parry, and Jedi Hunter, and has an option to hit multiple pieces with Spinning Blade Attack, but he's also balanced with a low attack and no ranged defense. He's featured in this Weeks designed squad, which won Minis Mania in 2012, as well as winning the final of the Hutt Regional in 2013. Quote:--Hero of Hyperbole-- 42 General Grievous, Hero of Hypori 36 Darth Sidious 31 IG Lancer Droid 27 Lobot 10 San Hill 9 Battle Droid Officer 9 Poggle the Lesser 36 Geonosian Drone x18 (200pts. 25 activations) Some support options for Grievous include: - you can use Vehicle on the Grievous on Tsmeu-6 Wheel Bike to clear out some fodder and get him into position to make a big hit on a Jedi. - a spotter droid helps him with ranged defense. - OOM-9 can give him a +3 attack and +3 defense bonus, which is certainly interesting since his low attack is a weakness. - Grievous's Bodyguard Droid - he just got his very own bodyguard. General Grievous, Hero of Hypori is a great piece, who's well balanced, and certainly good enough to be a competitive option, 10/10.
|
|
Guest |