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Official Tournament Rules? Have there been changes, ever? Options
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:19:08 PM
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I have been playing SWM for a couple of years, but have really went all in a few months ago. Basically, I'm not sure if I am playing by the correct rules or not. I have just printed out the 48 page SWM rule book and glossary (the one with the clone trooper on the front) and I am wondering if the rules are the same then as now? Have there been updates or changes? I do not so much mean are there new abilities or force powers, but rather actual changes to rules and play etc.. For example, do you still have to run up to a door and then wait until your next turn to go inside? Could someone direct me to a website or something that has an updated, official tournament rule book if one even exist?
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:29:39 PM
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The SWM community now exists as:

http://bloomilk.com : This site. Probably the most active discussion forums. Plus it has the squadbuilder and database of every piece.

http://www.swmresources.com/ : This site hosts the most important downloads. It has the PDFs of all the Vsets (the releases since WotC discontinued the game), the rules, VASSAL downloads (for online play), and the visual map list (including all the great maps by Mapmaker and JediCartographer/AdventurersAtlas).

http://swmgamers.com : This site is in some sense the 'official' site because this is where the discussions about Vset development and (presumably) GenCon organization take place, but it's relatively difficult to navigate and most of the important discussions are hidden in private forums. I think it also has most of the downloads that swmresources has, but if so it's not as easy to find as it is on swmresources.com.

The document you are looking for is the SWMGPA Floor Rules halfway down on the swmresources link.

For tournaments, the two main changes from the printed rulebook that you have are:

* First phase of each round, whoever goes first activates one character. All other phases are two characters per phase. This reduces (but by no means eliminates!) the importance of the random initiative roll.

* Gambit scoring. At the end of each round, if a player has a character that costs 5 or more within 4 squares of the center of the map, that player gains 5 points. Every enemy defeated is worth a number of points equal to that character's cost. First player to reach points equal to the cost of the squad wins. This forces players to engage and makes for a more fun (and faster) game.
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:42:32 PM
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Thank-you. This looks extremely helpful. I am sure I have many more questions, but I'll dive into those resources first. Is there an independent body that is still making new SWM that are sanctioned for tournament play? Also, I noticed the Boba Fett BH basically is not allowed to use his disintegration abilitya nd is this a restriction for dynamic duo only or for all tournament formats ie. 100, 150, 200 etc... Is that the only legal modification done to any of the existing cards, or are there other SWM that have restrictions on abilities, force powers, CE etc...?
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:47:33 PM
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Oh - one other rule is Force Abilities. This is the only new rule that the Vset developers introduced. (They introduced lots of new abilities/powers, but only one new rule that would go in the rulebook.)

If you're not playing with Vsets, just ignore it. But if you play with Vset cards, you will see that some characters can gain Force Abilities. A Force Ability is kind of like an ongoing force power. It affects things like a force power does, so it doesn't affect Vong or anything inside a Ysalimiri bubble. Some force power last until the end of the skirmish. Some end before the end of the skirmish. If a force ability does NOT last until the end of the skirmish, it can be turned off by the enemy. The force ability ends if...

* the character is hit by an attack
* the character rolls a save
* spends a force point
* takes damage

Quote:
Force abilities: Some characters have Force powers that remain in effect beyond that character's turn. These are called Force abilities. A Force ability remains active for the designated time. Force abilities cannot be cancelled unless the character is defeated, or at the moment the ability is activated (if a character with a Force canceling power like Force Absorb or Force Defense is within the required range at the time of activation). Force abilities that don't last until the end of the skirmish are negated prematurely if the character using it rolls a save, spends Force points, makes an attack, or is dealt damage. The ability immediately ends if the character joins an opponent's squad. Characters with Force Immunity ignore Force abilities.


http://www.swmgamers.com/e107_files/downloads/dotfrules.pdf
(The link is to the glossary insert for the first Vset.)
TheHutts
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:49:20 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
Thank-you. This looks extremely helpful. I am sure I have many more questions, but I'll dive into those resources first. Is there an independent body that is still making new SWM that are sanctioned for tournament play? Also, I noticed the Boba Fett BH basically is not allowed to use his disintegration ability. Is that the only legal modification done to any of the existing cards, or are there other SWM that have restrictions on abilities, force powers, CE etc...?


Yup - the 6th v-set is just about to be released within the next couple of weeks. You can download them at http://www.swmresources.com/ and engineer has printed copies of most of them available to send out. They're all designed/play-tested within the community, and are designed to balance with the top tier of Wizards pieces. If you're not used to playing with the most powerful Wizards squads (eg the Skybuck squad with General Skywalker, Yoda on Kybuck, Captain Panaka, and Dash Renegade Smuggler) you might find them full on, but they add lots to the game and bring neglected factions (Mandalorians, Vong, Old Republic, Sith) up to the same level as the other factions.

I think the restriction on Boba Fett BH's disintegration is only for the dynamic duos format (where you have two pieces adding up to exactly 100 points).
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:50:54 PM
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These "V-Sets" then are cards only that you print or are there actual miniatures that go along with them that you purchase?
AndyHatton
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:51:12 PM
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TheHutts wrote:
I think the restriction on Boba Fett BH's disintegration is only for the dynamic duos format (where you have two pieces adding up to exactly 100 points).


I think that is the case and maybe a few of the other fun formats, but Boba's disintegration is legal in standard tournaments

darthbinks1 wrote:
These "V-Sets" then are cards only that you print or are there actual miniatures that go along with them that you purchase?


They are cards that you can print out yourself or contact engineer for that go with your existing minis. Each card has a "recomended" mini on there that goes with the card, but you can use pretty much anything you want (including customs) as long as it is very clear
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:55:36 PM
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Ahhh. That makes sense. Sometimes when I scan around this website (especially the character rating page) I see minis I did not think they made. Are those V-set minis or something different?
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:56:57 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
Thank-you. This looks extremely helpful. I am sure I have many more questions, but I'll dive into those resources first. Is there an independent body that is still making new SWM that are sanctioned for tournament play? Also, I noticed the Boba Fett BH basically is not allowed to use his disintegration abilitya nd is this a restriction for dynamic duo only or for all tournament formats ie. 100, 150, 200 etc... Is that the only legal modification done to any of the existing cards, or are there other SWM that have restrictions on abilities, force powers, CE etc...?


The Boba BH restriction is only for Dynamic Duo format. There are no banned cards for general tournaments. The only errata is for obvious typos, and most of that has been established for years - no card has altered with errata for gameplay reasons.

Yes, there is still an independent body making SWM cards (not minis) sanctioned for tournament play. The printed cards are really nice (glossy), but you can also print your own from the posted PDFs. Contact the user 'engineer' to get your own copy of the cards.

The Vsets are the cards sanctioned for tournament play, and there have been 5 sets put out so far. Each set is 60 cards, plus a 12 card themed 'mini' set to go with it. The committee of people making the cards is a rotating body of 3 or 4 of the top players/most involved posters. There's always a need for playtesters, too. If you playtest enough, you could probably work your way onto the design committee. But playtesting 'enough' = a LOT of work.

With the dwindling player base, the biggest issue is that there aren't as many tournaments anymore. There will still be the GenCon championships. There were regional tournaments, too, all over the country. However, there aren't many places that are having weekly or monthly tournaments anymore. Where are you located? Wherever you are, if you're close enough to anyone here they'll happily invite you into a playgroup.
AndyHatton
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 3:59:30 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
Ahhh. That makes sense. Sometimes when I scan around this website (especially the character rating page) I see minis I did not think they made. Are those V-set minis or something different?


Yep, all the V-set stats are available on the character pages (and for use in the squad builder) If you don't like them (some don't, I think they are great) you can turn them off from that though.
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:01:07 PM
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I live 20 minutes south of Buffalo, NY. Oddly enough I was surprised to see that Western New York had a regional tournament this past June 1st. It seemed funny to me that Western New York was in the same line-up as Chicago and Pennsylvania. Do you know exactly where in Western New York they held the regionals and if it is a annual spot or not?
AndyHatton
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:05:45 PM
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WNY is usually a staple of the Regional scene and I believe it was in Rochester. I'd message DARPH_NADER, he tends to run the WNY scene as far as I know/is very active. I think they also usually have an off-regional tournament in the winter.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:06:00 PM
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Contact DARPH NADER. He organized it and is a very active player. He almost drove all the way down to Delaware to attend that regional. I don't know how big hit playgroup is, though.
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:12:26 PM
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What is the bounty hunter challenge? I noticed that there are two cards both exactly 100 points.
AndyHatton
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:16:48 PM
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The Bounty Hunter's Challenge was a special event that was run at GenCon last year, I'm not 100% sure on the rules but I believe you had to bring a squad and you played against the folks running the tournament who played the 100 point Luke or the 100 point Sidious. Both are legal for tournament play. They were included with the Galactic Heroes V-set if you get one though there are Gen Con promos floating around too I believe.


(ALSO THIS IS MY 900th post!)BlooMilk ThumbsUp BlooMilk ThumpUp BlooMilk BigGrin BlooMilk Woot BlooMilk
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:20:47 PM
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thanks, very cool idea.
darthbinks1
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:30:57 PM
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I'm surprised to hear that no cards are banned. I thought I heard that the general kenobi card was banned.
Sithborg
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:37:52 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
I'm surprised to hear that no cards are banned. I thought I heard that the general kenobi card was banned.


Temporarily. I believe it was all of 6 months before there was the DCI errata to SSM, and then about a year ago, SSM was reverted to the card text.
TheHutts
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:38:29 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
I'm surprised to hear that no cards are banned. I thought I heard that the general kenobi card was banned.


General Obi-Wan Kenobi's status has gone through a few changes - in the past he's been banned, he's had Soresu Style Mastery neutered to only non-melee attacks - but he's now reinstated and plays as his cards says. He's definitely really tough and was part of the US Champion squad last year, but there are a few more direct damage options in the v-set that get round Soresu Style Mastery, and a few other counters for him. One of the objectives of the v-sets was to have everything from Wizards preserved - so anyone who used to play can come back in, and nothing is banned or changed (except erratas for mistakes).
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, July 31, 2013 4:43:19 PM
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darthbinks1 wrote:
I'm surprised to hear that no cards are banned. I thought I heard that the general kenobi card was banned.


General Obi-Wan Kenobi was at one point banned.
Then his Soresu Style Mastery ability was errata'ed to only apply to non-melee attacks.
Now he works as the ability is printed on the card.

The main difference now is that the Vsets have brought in a lot more pieces that deal direct damage (non-attacks), and pieces that deal damage with attacks that cannot be avoided (similar to Lord Vader's Overwhelming Force). There is now enough that SSM is still powerful, but no longer powerful enough to break the game. GOWK is still a very potent piece, though.

So now there's a bit of rock-paper-scissors. Direct-Damage pieces beat Damage Avoiders. Damage Avoiders beat Big Attackers (because much of their damage is negated). Big Attackers beat Direct-Damage (the attackers do more damage, it's just that the Direct-Damage always goes through). Of course, few pieces fit cleanly into one of those three categories like GOWK does, and you generally want a good squad to have a balance of them.
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