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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/5/2009 Posts: 2,240 Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
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We were playing the other weekend and a couple guys were rolling thier twins, even though the target was defeated, beyond any possible help, and said that was standard thing to do, claiming one must roll that second. You might roll a 20 that would be wasted on a dead guy instead of doing damage to a new target.
Is this true in competition?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/29/2011 Posts: 1,766 Location: In a sinkhole on Utapau
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I've never really thought about it, so I'm interested to see the answer too. On Vassal, I know most people just go roll, roll very quickly and then determine if at least one hit and defeated the target.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/2/2013 Posts: 46
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My guess is, the only time you are forced to complete the twin attack is either when you are shooting a piece that has not died, or you are shooting yourself via JarJar.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 8/24/2008 Posts: 5,201
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As per the Resolving Effects section of the FAQ, the enemy is removed from the board before you can start the Twin Attack. So, no Twin Attack.
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Also, one roll doesn't change the probability of the next roll. However, if you did roll a 'null attack' of that sort you could trigger Internal Strife or something like that, so it's not a good idea to roll it when you're not supposed to.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/5/2009 Posts: 2,240 Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
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Sithborg wrote:As per the Resolving Effects section of the FAQ, the enemy is removed from the board before you can start the Twin Attack. So, no Twin Attack. See what happens when your brain is asleep? D'oh. I most times check the rules/glossary, but forget Resolving Effects. Thanks guys.
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A related question... it appears that the wording of Twin Attack indicates that the Twin is in fact mandatory if the target is still alive. Is that correct? I've never been in a situation where I didn't want to take the Twin Attack. I would have thought it was optional, but it appears that maybe it isn't.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Twin Attack is not optional.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 9/1/2008 Posts: 818 Location: Wisconsin
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FlyingArrow wrote:A related question... it appears that the wording of Twin Attack indicates that the Twin is in fact mandatory if the target is still alive. Is that correct? I've never been in a situation where I didn't want to take the Twin Attack. I would have thought it was optional, but it appears that maybe it isn't. Sithborg wrote:Twin Attack is not optional. That's right ... think about that when you're hitting that Self Destruct target who is standing next to one of your allies.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/12/2012 Posts: 456 Location: Kokomo, IN
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a related question a twin att. counts as a single att. correct? because I asked previously if a character with twin would still be able to use Master Yodas CE that grant an extra att. to an ally that had only made a single att. on its' turn and was told that they wouldn't benefit from that CE. I was wondering why since as I understand it a twin counts as a single att.
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gholli69 wrote:a related question a twin att. counts as a single att. correct? because I asked previously if a character with twin would still be able to use Master Yodas CE that grant an extra att. to an ally that had only made a single att. on its' turn and was told that they wouldn't benefit from that CE. I was wondering why since as I understand it a twin counts as a single att.
It's an extra attack against a single target; still 2 attacks. To illustrate, a force user with Double Attack can choose to move/attack or attack/move, giving up the use of Double. Since it only attacked once on its turn, it would then qualify for Master Yoda's CE. With Twin Attack that isn't possible as you always attack the target twice, unless the first attack of the twin defeats the target. If that happens and another target is available for the attack granted by Master Yoda, the CE can be used.
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swinefeld wrote: To illustrate, a force user with Double Attack can choose to move/attack or attack/move, giving up the use of Double. Since it only attacked once on its turn, it would then qualify for Master Yoda's CE.
With Twin Attack that isn't possible as you always attack the target twice, unless the first attack of the twin defeats the target. If that happens and another target is available for the attack granted by Master Yoda, the CE can be used.
Or if the attack is canceled before it happens. By Pheromones, for example.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/5/2009 Posts: 2,240 Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
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FlyingArrow wrote:swinefeld wrote: To illustrate, a force user with Double Attack can choose to move/attack or attack/move, giving up the use of Double. Since it only attacked once on its turn, it would then qualify for Master Yoda's CE.
With Twin Attack that isn't possible as you always attack the target twice, unless the first attack of the twin defeats the target. If that happens and another target is available for the attack granted by Master Yoda, the CE can be used.
Or if the attack is canceled before it happens. By Pheromones, for example. Except you can't attack a different target with Master Yoda's CE.
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juice man wrote:FlyingArrow wrote:swinefeld wrote: To illustrate, a force user with Double Attack can choose to move/attack or attack/move, giving up the use of Double. Since it only attacked once on its turn, it would then qualify for Master Yoda's CE.
With Twin Attack that isn't possible as you always attack the target twice, unless the first attack of the twin defeats the target. If that happens and another target is available for the attack granted by Master Yoda, the CE can be used.
Or if the attack is canceled before it happens. By Pheromones, for example. Except you can't attack a different target with Master Yoda's CE. Correct. Suppose on your turn you attack Xizor and you have Twin Attack, and on the first attack you pass Pheromones and make the normal attack. Then the Twin Attack kicks in. You have to roll Pheromones again. If you fail the second one, then you never make the second attack. In that case, Yoda's CE could kick in and you would get to try attacking Xizor again. (It would have to be Xizor. You couldn't choose another target.) You'd attack twice, actually, since Twin Attack would trigger on the granted attack as well. In this case, it could be a good thing to fail the Pheromones save. == Edit: And what I just said there is incorrect.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/5/2009 Posts: 2,240 Location: Akron Ohio, just south of dantooine.
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Actually, with Pheromones, the attack is still considered to have been made. So you've still attacked twice.
Edit: Anyone for a good old-fasioned game of Risk?
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juice man wrote:Actually, with Pheromones, the attack is still considered to have been made. So you've still attacked twice. Good call. Pheromones glossary entry:This special ability cancels an attack made by a living enemy within 6 squares against this creature. The attacker can resist this effect with a save of 11. Roll the save immediately after the attack is declared but before making the attack roll. That attack is still considered to have been made this turn, and the affected character still spends Force points (if any) used in that attack.
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I thought I read that if people with Djem so and twin fought, they could end up in an infinite loop (if they made their saves of course), even if they we're both technically dead?
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crazybirdman wrote:I thought I read that if people with Djem so and twin fought, they could end up in an infinite loop (if they made their saves of course), even if they we're both technically dead? Yes. It doesn't even require Twin, actually, but Twin makes it more likely to happen since there are more chances to hit and chances to make Djem So saves. It can happen because in that case each attack is suspended while another attack begins. Damage is applied after resolving the newly created attack. http://www.bloomilk.com/Forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=10805A has 40hp. B has 30hp. 1. A hits B for 20. 2. B Djem So hits A for 20. 3. A Djem So hits B for 40. 4. B Djem So hits A for 20. 5. A Djem So hits B for 20. (pointless) 5b. Attack #5 is completed and 20 damage is applied to B. 4b. Attack #4 is completed and 20 damage is applied to A. 3b. Attack #3 is completed and 40 damage is applied to B. It is enough to kill B. 2b. Attack #2 is completed and 20 damage is applied to A. It is enough to kill A. 1b. Attack #1 is completed, but B has already been removed from the grid. On the 5th attack, A attacks B when everybody already knows that both pieces are going to die. The damage racked up in the first 4 attacks will kill both of them. That's why attack #5 is pointless, unless maybe he's hoping for a Flurry attack on an adjacent enemy or something like that.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
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@crazybirdman- if that is true that isn't practical and should be errated... If a character is dead it is dead, with the exceptions of death shots, self destruct, force spirits and the like a character should seas the moment it is dead.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
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crazybirdman wrote:I thought I read that if people with Djem so and twin fought, they could end up in an infinite loop (if they made their saves of course), even if they we're both technically dead? yes this can happen, but you can also stop it by not Djem SOing. YOu must make the Save, but do not have to make the attack.
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