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Vong thud bugs were discussed last weekend. nobody like that they do 20 unstoppable damage( except Joe) save 16 was one thought to lessen the pain, but that wouldn't help Jedi  any more things that may need examination? 
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Blast Bugs would be on top of my list too.
As a member of last year's balance committee, I would have loved to have been able to do something about them, but there wasn't really the tournament data to back it up. I don't know if they've even made the final of a big event - i can't remember anything offhand.
But as some of the other more abusive non-uniques have been toned down (Naboo, Klat Assassins, Daala swarms) they're probably the biggest one that's remained untouched.
I just don't think they're very fun to play against, and Vong have other top tier options like Domain Lah and Nom Bombs.
My other hobby horse is taking Ysalamari out of a faction - I don't really like three factions having force immunity (including Vong where most of the individual pieces are force immune).
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So Graham I assume you'd be taking it out of Imperials?
Vong must keep it, IMO. It's literally their thing.
Blast Bugs were just a bad idea from the start.
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TimmerB123 wrote:So Graham I assume you'd be taking it out of Imperials?
Vong must keep it, IMO. It's literally their thing.
Blast Bugs were just a bad idea from the start. I definitely wouldn't take it out of Vong. Ideally, IMO, Talon would have Black Ops instead of Ysalamari.
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TheHutts wrote:TimmerB123 wrote:So Graham I assume you'd be taking it out of Imperials?
Vong must keep it, IMO. It's literally their thing.
Blast Bugs were just a bad idea from the start. I definitely wouldn't take it out of Vong. Ideally, IMO, Talon would have Black Ops instead of Ysalamari. Imps can compete just fine without it. It's harder for Talon squads to, and other fringe only is not up to top tier yet. Also a lot of work was put into Aves to just have Talon handed black ops. (See recent thread regarding Aves)
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jak wrote:save 16 was one thought to lessen the pain, but that wouldn't help Jedi Save 16 would likely be still too effective. If I altered it, I'd go 2 saves of 11 to reduce the damage by 10 apiece.
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EmporerDragon wrote:jak wrote:save 16 was one thought to lessen the pain, but that wouldn't help Jedi Save 16 would likely be still too effective. If I altered it, I'd go 2 saves of 11 to reduce the damage by 10 apiece. Maybe a save of 11 to reduce it to 10? Like a non-FP version of Force Thrust? The 2 saves sound good too.
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Range 2? Extended to 4?
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Why not just 10 damage blast?
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Recosting the Commander to like 35 could also work.
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TheHutts wrote:Recosting the Commander to like 35 could also work. He is incredibly undercosted, about as bad as the domain lah warriors.
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TheHutts wrote:Recosting the Commander to like 35 could also work. Just raising to 22 would probably be fine. One major point of contention is that he's an easy Quorreal reinforcement option. Otherwise - 20 auto damage lowered to 10 auto damage with a save 11 might work.
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atmsalad wrote:TheHutts wrote:Recosting the Commander to like 35 could also work. He is incredibly undercosted, about as bad as the domain lah warriors. The core issue is the undercosted Warriors. He just gives them another ridiculously good tool. I feel like you should have to build one way or the other, not get the best of both worlds. Honestly the Lah warriors are worse overall. They should cost 14
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TimmerB123 wrote:
20 auto damage lowered to 10 auto damage with a save 11 might work.
If that's the route to go, it might be better to then just leave Blast Bug as it is, but make the Subcommander no longer give it out, and then reserve the ability for future commander types or something to be given out via an ability similar to Munitions Supplies.
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don't like 2 saves, increases game time.  don't want to neuter it to much. I like a higher save. or save 11 for 10
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jak wrote:don't like 2 saves, increases game time. don't want to neuter it to much. I like a higher save. or save 11 for 10 For the same reason, I'd vote for no save at all. Either 10 damage instead of 20 (it is irreducible after all), or reduced range to 2. I'd say range 4, but if it's 2 it can be increased to 4 with a CE.
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EmporerDragon wrote:If that's the route to go, it might be better to then just leave Blast Bug as it is, but make the Subcommander no longer give it out, and then reserve the ability for future commander types or something to be given out via an ability similar to Munitions Supplies. This is my personal favorite. Possibly switching it from blast bug to thudbug would be a simple enough alternative.
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Reword the CE to make it harder to give the ability out. Adjacent or within 2. Then the WC Sub would have to come out of hiding and once killed, the problem is solved. Maybe until the Vong win once, everything should be left as is.
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My idea would be to raise the cost of the Subcommand to 24, and the Lah Warriors to 14.
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Warrior Caste Subcommander 19
Drop Blast Bug from the CE and give him Mobile Attack.
Only ONE character, 29pt Yuuzhan Vong Droid Hunter, has the (Razorbug-Mobile Attack) combo.
It's a great combo in a faction lacking in shooters. This guy hands it out, so I think he should have it too.
Which would mean HE could (Mobile-Blast Bug), way better than him giving it out. Now you really do have a reason to use him in the battle.
Only 10 characters in the game have Razorbug. So Warriors gaining Razorbug and Mobile is enough. IMHO
I wouldn't swap Blast Bug for Thud Bug. A lot of Warriors already have Thud Bug and the ones who don't, like "Domain Lah Warriors," really don't need it.
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