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What can beat the charging vong? Options
atmsalad
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 5:27:24 PM
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With all the talk about the charging vong I thought it would be cool if we snow balled quad ideas on what can beat it. Here's as close as Bryan and I could remember to joes squad.

--Charging B.A.M.F's--
30 Supreme Overlord Quorreal
29 Domain Shai Subaltern
28 Zenoc Quah
15 Yammosk War Coordinator
13 Yun-Ne'Shel Priest
70 Domain Lah Warrior x7
15 Zonoma Sekot Scout x3

(200pts. 15 activations)
atmsalad
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 5:30:05 PM
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Here's my best guess at it...

--HK's BS Lancer--
39 HK-47, Assassin Droid
31 IG Lancer Droid
27 Lobot
24 Commando Droid Captain
16 BX Commando Droid Spotter
30 BX Commando Droid Sniper x2
10 San Hill
9 Battle Droid Officer
8 Battle Droid x2
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2

Preferred Reinforcements:
(Lobot) 8 Muun Tactics Broker
(Lobot) 12 Mouse Droid x4

(200pts. 18 activations)

Disruptive, 3 guys that are shooting for thirty a hit with double, a strafer, out activating and winning init. Feel free to let me know what yall think and to post your own stuff.
urbanjedi
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 5:56:52 PM
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Big tanky Jedi

Cin
Serra
Adi
Foul
R2
Scorch
Marn
3x ugos
jen'ari
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 6:00:40 PM
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skybuck?
TheHutts
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 6:17:00 PM
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They are pretty weak on door control. What builds can exploit that? You could snipe off their door control and lock out on some maps.
DarkDracul
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 7:12:43 PM
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Location: Kokomo
urbanjedi wrote:
Big tanky Jedi

Cin
Serra
Adi
Foul
R2
Scorch
Marn
3x ugos


*It's not tankyness that beats Joe's squad, it's the aggression that wins here.
has 2 movement breakers (R2 & Foul) giving you the greater striking range. (18 squares.)
has 2 attackers each able to move and kill a Domain Lah Warrior in one turn.
4 guys, Marn and 3 uggs, get Blast Bug to reciprocate Blast Bug love to the 6 remaining warriors.

It can reduce the warriors down to 6 before your Jedi begin to take damage.
6 warriors is more manageable for a low act squad to deal with. The game becomes more balanced.
It also helps if you're an uber elite player with half a years worth of experience with the squad.

Other than Marn, this squad is very specific to Republic. (R2 & Foul) (Cin & Serra)
I don't think it's easily replicated in other factions. It would be interesting to see if anyone could.



DarkDracul
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 7:22:30 PM
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Location: Kokomo
atmsalad wrote:
Here's my best guess at it...

--HK's BS Lancer--
39 HK-47, Assassin Droid
31 IG Lancer Droid
27 Lobot
24 Commando Droid Captain
16 BX Commando Droid Spotter
30 BX Commando Droid Sniper x2
10 San Hill
9 Battle Droid Officer
8 Battle Droid x2
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2

Preferred Reinforcements:
(Lobot) 8 Muun Tactics Broker
(Lobot) 12 Mouse Droid x4

(200pts. 18 activations)

Disruptive, 3 guys that are shooting for thirty a hit with double, a strafer, out activating and winning init. Feel free to let me know what yall think and to post your own stuff.


So I guess you're done trying out low act squads huh?...lol
atmsalad
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 10:14:29 PM
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DarkDracul wrote:
So I guess you're done trying out low act squads huh?...lol


Lol, oh come on Bryan... It's only 18 acts with act control LOL
DarkDracul
Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 10:38:08 PM
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Fine, an improvement. b.t.w how are you killing the MTB? lol
dreadtech
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 2:53:28 PM
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Vong have gone from the worsted faction to mid faction. they are not the top faction and as such see no reason to change them at all. at anyone one time one faction has to be the top faction. I don't believe vong are but if you lot do, so what? next vset out that will change again.
TheHutts
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 3:09:11 PM
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dreadtech wrote:
Vong have gone from the worsted faction to mid faction. they are not the top faction and as such see no reason to change them at all. at anyone one time one faction has to be the top faction. I don't believe vong are but if you lot do, so what? next vset out that will change again.


What are you basing this on?

I see a squad that can cope with most things really well, and might well prove problematic. Unpreventable damage from hard to kill pieces is tough.

I probably think Imperials are the top faction with Daala, Thrawn, and Vader of Lothal builds all potentially very good, but this Vong squad is still very tough.

The balance committee toned down a lot of the nasty non-unique swarms at the end of last season, this feels like the big one that's still around.
dreadtech
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 4:34:17 PM
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Same thing you are basing yours on. I play this game a lot. Vong hard to beat? No more than any other faction. Unstoppable/unavoidable damage? really? because every other factions has this as well, is that what you are claiming? vong are too hard because of unavoidable damage? or swam squads. There is nothing wrong with swarm squads and in-fact other squads can be far more affective than vong at this.
Yes some have counter abilities but its impossible to take a counter squad for every possible squad. Squads change over time as an expanding game such as SWM should. So my comment still stands, I don't believe vong are the top faction out there but IF you do, again so what? how is this any different to imperial or rebel being top faction. One faction has to be as its impossible to get every faction on an even footing. So what if vong is the top faction? will they be after next vset, or the one after that or one after that? When another faction is the top one you going to alter all there skills? You will never get perfect balance. So going back and altering skills is wrong, you just bring out new characters to change the dynamic next time round. Another faction then become top teir until the next set out. This concept has been around since day one.


If you guys are now saying you need to go back and change vset cards or abilities because you don't like them, then its time to end the vsets. as this will just be a never ending process to get an unattainable balance.


Think I'm done on this subject.
Darth_Jim
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 4:57:16 PM
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What was that rant about? We're talking about a specific squad, not a faction.

My plan to deal with it is to swap out Dash for Morrigan. Joe and I played a good game, but if I don't make a switch I don't think I can handle it. Embo went down way too quickly.

As far as jedi go, I still think we need to compare Jason's squad with Etienne's and Bryan's. Why did his work against it and theirs didn't?
DarkDracul
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 7:24:02 PM
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Morrigan is a good call. You can actually pick off warriors and if you get los on the Warrior Caste Sub or Subaltern you can shut them down.
You probably need to kill the Scout asap to nerf the activation control. Prevent them from charging en-mass, especially before reach Talon.
General_Grievous
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 8:18:52 PM
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I think a team of the new Rebels characters could be a good build with Hera bypassing their armor. Also BHC Dooku or Obi Wan would be good options
TheHutts
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 8:26:15 PM
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General_Grievous wrote:
Also BHC Dooku or Obi Wan would be good options


They're really good against big tanky pieces with defensive abilities as they just ignore parry/soresu and do 20 damage a pop with Blast Bug. I heard atm's Dooku got annihilated.
General_Grievous
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 9:03:32 PM
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Ah that's fair I was thinking more the charging part. With blast bugs I would go for a strafe team, Grievous Wheelbike wit snipers/spotters is what allowed me to beat a Vong Lah warrior team in the regional last year
DarkDracul
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 9:40:44 PM
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You're outactivated, WCS with Aggressive Negotiations blocks your path and Blast Bugs while keeping "diplomat". Then warriors go 8 squares to Blast Bug your guys. You take 160~180 unpreventable damage. Next round you are tangled up with the double twinning warriors. Will finish you off in 3 rounds. Etienne was killed in 3 rounds, less than 30 mins, 0pts. I took him a 4th round to clean me up, over 30 mins, got 30pts...

Jason and Jim's squads give you; lots of movement breaking and ability to move and kill a warrior in a turn..flight, agile, ect. to move past their guys. Disruptive, but perhaps the only one able to go toe-to-toe with them is Vindicated. Maybe a Mando squad might be good against them but now we're talking about shooter squads. In low act melee Republic probably has the best answers and still able to remain competitive against the rest of the field.

DarkDracul
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 9:42:29 PM
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General_Grievous wrote:
Ah that's fair I was thinking more the charging part. With blast bugs I would go for a strafe team, Grievous Wheelbike wit snipers/spotters is what allowed me to beat a Vong Lah warrior team in the regional last year
Yeah! sounds so last year..Glare
atmsalad
Posted: Monday, February 29, 2016 11:52:21 PM
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For the record, I did get my ass kicked, but I got 2 rounds of gambit and killed 1 lah warrior. Scrapped 30 points out of that crap shoot, lol
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