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jak wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:
In the event that nobody brings a Daala squad wouldn't that also speak volumes about what the community thinks about her?
that would rock!  I'm dreading the 200 pt tourny just because of beitch Daala if too many daala squads play I'll just skip the 200 event  Alright after seeing this post from jak, it is time for me to act on this matter. In a reality wherein the U.S. playing field continues to contract at an alarming rate, I as a T.O. must act. We cannot afford to lose/alienate active players who make the effort to travel and support our game. Daala is hereby banned from the FrostyCon 200. The above post is all the proof this community needs to see that ACTION must be taken to preserve the structural integrity of the game. I will not have FrostyCon ruined over this disturbance in the meta, nor will I accept it as a play testing arena to prove out 13+ bloody pages of dialogue. Those of you who know me well, know I have a low tolerance for inaction. I've invested a significant amount of capital and time to produce a venue for players to come and ENJOY playing SWM events in a positive environment. There will be plenty of opportunities throughout the weekend should players wish to engage in Daala games and that is that.
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DARPH NADER wrote:jak wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:
In the event that nobody brings a Daala squad wouldn't that also speak volumes about what the community thinks about her?
that would rock! I'm dreading the 200 pt tourny just because of beitch Daala if too many daala squads play I'll just skip the 200 event Alright after seeing this post from jak, it is time for me to act on this matter. In a reality wherein the U.S. playing field continues to contract at an alarming rate, I as a T.O. must act. We cannot afford to lose/alienate active players who make the effort to travel and support our game. Daala is hereby banned from the FrostyCon 200. The above post is all the proof this community needs to see that ACTION must be taken to preserve the structural integrity of the game. I will not have FrostyCon ruined over this disturbance in the meta, nor will I accept it as a play testing arena to prove out 13+ bloody pages of dialogue. Those of you who know me well, know I have a low tolerance for inaction. I've invested a significant amount of capital and time to produce a venue for players to come and ENJOY playing SWM events in a positive environment. There will be plenty of opportunities throughout the weekend should players wish to engage in Daala games and that is that. Here! Here! 
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You are setting a terrible precedent that will have more negative impact on the game than positive.
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I have the sneaky suspicion that nobody was going to run her anyway.
Too stubborn of a group here. Nobody wanted the hollow victory.
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I'll spend time to help playtest Dalaa during the X-Wing tourney. (Instead of getting my butt kicked in a game I've only played once.)
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TimmerB123 wrote:I have the sneaky suspicion that nobody was going to run her anyway.
Too stubborn of a group here. Nobody wanted the hollow victory. I did! I did!  Depending on the early playtesting.
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billiv15 wrote:You are setting a terrible precedent that will have more negative impact on the game than positive. Bill..... this is sad. He did what had to be done to SAVE a tournament that he has put together for the ENJOYMENT of playing starwars minis. Why should he have to watch people play an npe that has generated 13 pages of talk,when he can and should have banned her for this tournament. It is not fair to use this tournament as playtesting and possibly kill a few players desire to play the game completely. I wonder what precedent you would set.... a do nothing precedent where we don't care for the small community we have left, or one where we are willing to act and try to save some of the enjoyment of the game? What I suggest is that we use a great resource available to the community to test Daala.... Vassal. what about setting up a Vassal Test for her... That way no one has to travel to either prove or disprove these 13 pages and no one has to spend money to most likely have a bad experience losing, or heck a bad experience winning with Daala.
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billiv15 wrote:You are setting a terrible precedent that will have more negative impact on the game than positive. To quote the great Bill Lumbergh, "Ooh, yeah. Ummm, I'm gonna have to go ahead and sort of disagree with you there."LumberghFrostyCon is something set up and run (even funded?) entirely by Gerry, which means that it's HIS tournament. It's not a Regional or a Gencon event, or anything else "official." It's really no different than local playgroups that agree among themselves not to use Bastilla or Mace or Poggle. Furthermore, I think this precedent actually helps the game. With a shrinking community, we cannot afford to have negative experiences at big events. By banning Daala at FrostyCon, Gerry is making a bold statement that SWM is for fun...even "competitive SWM." When it stops being fun, people will stop playing. I've already said that I'm not interested in attending Gencon ( ) if we have a restricted meta. And so, FWIW, I fully support Gerry in his decision. If anything, it will only reinforce the importance of taking appropriate action on this piece (these pieces) which have caused such a problem for the game.
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I am not as experienced with Daala. I don't do tournaments (unless one would ever be in Iowa) so I don't get to see the issue first hand being performed by players that play all the time. Is the issue prideful or the movement breaker or the cost trim? I'm sure it's all of the above but which one is the real backbreaker? If it's prideful, would this be something that could help out. my custom attempt to deflect prideful
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I have probably played 15-20 games using Daala snowtroopers. Not sure how that matches up to other people - my guess is more than just about anyone else other than Dr Daman. In any case, it's more than I've played any other squad type. Even though I'm pretty invested in the piece, I think a ban is the right move at least until a consensus can be reached about a more permanent solution.
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FlyingArrow wrote:I have probably played 15-20 games using Daala snowtroopers. Not sure how that matches up to other people - my guess is more than just about anyone else other than Dr Daman. In any case, it's more than I've played any other squad type. Even though I'm pretty invested in the piece, I think a ban is the right move at least until a consensus can be reached about a more permanent solution.
You hit the nail on the head. A ban is absolutely the right move, until this mess with Daala, and the Zygerian gets fixed by the brain trust behind the scenes. Even IF there was a gentleman's agreement in place that no one would run her. Because there is always that one douchebag like me who would run her, just to do it. 
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theultrastar wrote:FlyingArrow wrote:I have probably played 15-20 games using Daala snowtroopers. Not sure how that matches up to other people - my guess is more than just about anyone else other than Dr Daman. In any case, it's more than I've played any other squad type. Even though I'm pretty invested in the piece, I think a ban is the right move at least until a consensus can be reached about a more permanent solution.
You hit the nail on the head. A ban is absolutely the right move, until this mess with Daala, and the Zygerian gets fixed by the brain trust behind the scenes. Even IF there was a gentleman's agreement in place that no one would run her. Because there is always that one douchebag like me who would run her, just to do it. *puts on sunglasses inside* No rule that says I can't bro. thereisnotry wrote:
FrostyCon is something set up and run (even funded?) entirely by Gerry, which means that it's HIS tournament. It's not a Regional or a Gencon event, or anything else "official." It's really no different than local playgroups that agree among themselves not to use Bastilla or Mace or Poggle.
EXACTLY what I was going to say. +1
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I think the Ban is a good idea, atleast until she gets straightened out.
I suggest an errata weakoning her CE ans an Errata on the Slaver making the target only move speed.
I think thats the best way to get them more balanced without totally neutering the whole squad type.
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As it stands now it appears urbanjedi, Timmer, juice man and jak are all sitting out the X-wing and after having either spoken or messaged with 3 of them I think it's a certainty that some meaningful play testing of Daala will take place at that time.
Gerry banning Daala for this specific tournament is the right move. It seems as if it will only be a matter of time until a fix is determined. No reason for her to be used as written at this stage for a tournament setting.
Although it seems certain that meaningful feedback will come out of the Daala play test @ Frosty I highly encourage people to get on Vassal and compile more info. All the talk at this point means little when a fix is needed with the Michigan regional approaching.
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Galactic Funk wrote:As it stands now it appears urbanjedi, Timmer, juice man and jak are all sitting out the X-wing and after having either spoken or messaged with 3 of them I think it's a certainty that some meaningful play testing of Daala will take place at that time.
Gerry banning Daala for this specific tournament is the right move. It seems as if it will only be a matter of time until a fix is determined. No reason for her to be used as written at this stage for a tournament setting.
Although it seems certain that meaningful feedback will come out of the Daala play test @ Frosty I highly encourage people to get on Vassal and compile more info. All the talk at this point means little when a fix is needed with the Michigan regional approaching. +1 People also should try abusing the Zygerrian to determine if it breaks other things outside of Daala squads.
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swinefeld wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:As it stands now it appears urbanjedi, Timmer, juice man and jak are all sitting out the X-wing and after having either spoken or messaged with 3 of them I think it's a certainty that some meaningful play testing of Daala will take place at that time.
Gerry banning Daala for this specific tournament is the right move. It seems as if it will only be a matter of time until a fix is determined. No reason for her to be used as written at this stage for a tournament setting.
Although it seems certain that meaningful feedback will come out of the Daala play test @ Frosty I highly encourage people to get on Vassal and compile more info. All the talk at this point means little when a fix is needed with the Michigan regional approaching. +1 People also should try abusing the Zygerrian to determine if it breaks other things outside of Daala squads. Yes. It's insane to expect any change to the Zygerrian without other tests.
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Maybe Daala needs Rival (This character may be in a squad that contains only Imperial characters).
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Echo24 wrote:swinefeld wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:As it stands now it appears urbanjedi, Timmer, juice man and jak are all sitting out the X-wing and after having either spoken or messaged with 3 of them I think it's a certainty that some meaningful play testing of Daala will take place at that time.
Gerry banning Daala for this specific tournament is the right move. It seems as if it will only be a matter of time until a fix is determined. No reason for her to be used as written at this stage for a tournament setting.
Although it seems certain that meaningful feedback will come out of the Daala play test @ Frosty I highly encourage people to get on Vassal and compile more info. All the talk at this point means little when a fix is needed with the Michigan regional approaching. +1 People also should try abusing the Zygerrian to determine if it breaks other things outside of Daala squads. Yes. It's insane to expect any change to the Zygerrian without other tests. It's insane to expect change? It's insane to put out a stat block for a MOVEMENT BREAKER on an 8pt fringe non unique. EDIT: It's also insane that we are still playtesting V6.
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theultrastar wrote:Echo24 wrote:swinefeld wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:As it stands now it appears urbanjedi, Timmer, juice man and jak are all sitting out the X-wing and after having either spoken or messaged with 3 of them I think it's a certainty that some meaningful play testing of Daala will take place at that time.
Gerry banning Daala for this specific tournament is the right move. It seems as if it will only be a matter of time until a fix is determined. No reason for her to be used as written at this stage for a tournament setting.
Although it seems certain that meaningful feedback will come out of the Daala play test @ Frosty I highly encourage people to get on Vassal and compile more info. All the talk at this point means little when a fix is needed with the Michigan regional approaching. +1 People also should try abusing the Zygerrian to determine if it breaks other things outside of Daala squads. Yes. It's insane to expect any change to the Zygerrian without other tests. It's insane to expect change? It's insane to put out a stat block for a MOVEMENT BREAKER on an 8pt fringe non unique. EDIT: It's also inane that we are still playtesting V6. I don't think it's fair to say we are still play testing Vset 6. I feel like that's just a dig at the designersor Vset team which probably isn't fair. They play test as much as they can, and other play testers are slim and hard to come by, it's extremely hard to play test 72 characters with not as much help as needed. Just because 1-2 pieces fell through the cracks is okay by me, because the community will eventually fix them anyway.
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What would the change be exactly? Rivalry for Daala? For Imperials? Slave Driver only works on Fringe characters? Characters with melee? Some combination of the above? Any of those fix the Daala issue, but implementing one without testing it thoroughly is what caused this mess. Let's learn from the mistake, not repeat it.
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