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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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How dependent has the game become on the v-sets. Are they generally better cards then the original SWM by WOTC. I feel like I'm hearing here that they are a necessity in today's game to have a chance at doing well or am I wrong. Also, what does errata'ed, DCI and SSM all stand for?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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What is GOWK?
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 8/9/2009 Posts: 1,935
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You do not have to use the V-sets if you do not want to. I think they are fun and they have opened up the game a lot. It isn't necesarrily that they are better, they offer balance to the game. The way WotC left the game only a few factions and squad types were competetive, it stagnated the game and made it unfun at times (at least to me.) The V-sets allow pretty much any faction to compete with generally a few different great squads per faction. If you want to you can still do well with the old comptetive WotC Sqauds. You don't have to play withe V-sets if you don't want to, I don't think they are a necessity, and most squads have a good mix of WotC and V-set pieces.
Erratted means changed for game play purposes
DCI was the old governing body that made SWM tournament rules
SSM is Soresu Style Mastery
GOWK is General Obi-Wan Kenobi, the banned Obi-Wan you were talking about
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
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One player, Urbanjedi, has been going to Regionals this year and last year and playing squads with only pre-v-set pieces, and he's managed to win/do well with them. The handful of tournament level squads, pre v-set, can still compete, but there are way more tournament level squads available now with the v-sets. Most squads in a tournament will use v-sets, because there are more tournament-level pieces in the v-sets than in Wizards and because it's fun to play new pieces rather than play with 3-4 year old pieces that you're already played a lot.
Some Wizards pieces are still staples in their faction - eg you'd normally use Ganner Rhysode and General Dodonna in a New Republic squad. In other factions, like Sith, it's common to see squads with no Wizards pieces except fringe support pieces (Ugnaught Demolitionists, R7s, Lobot, Mouse Droids).
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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That sounds great. I still need to wrap my head around the WOTC pieces fully before I explore the V-sets, but I definitely understand what you mean by only a few squads being competitive. If the v-sets allow more squads to be competitive then great and it will give me much more fun in the future. Also, WOTC was great, but they first and foremost had to make money. I have no doubt that the people making the v-sets are attention to detail people and are creating the v-sets for fun and competition mainly. I am quite sure they have made the game much more competitive and enjoyable. That's how it appears to me from hearing from all of you anyway.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
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It can be a bit of a culture shock sometimes - the v-sets are stacked a lot more with tournament level pieces than the Wizards sets were. I think it's way better that way, as there's no point releasing pointless filler pieces, but it takes a lot of effort to learn the key pieces and what they do. In my opinion, the controversial pieces are all from the first couple of v-sets - I think it's a combination of the lesser factions needing keystone pieces (eg Old Republic's Bastila Shan Jedi Master) and just it being the first couple of sets and everyone getting better at the process of design and playtesting (Poggle the Lesser and Captain Panaka of Theed are both a bit strong IMO). But overall, they make the game a lot of fun - but 6 sets at once is a lot to take in.
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
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Most of WotC's pieces weren't competitive to begin with, and most of the rest became outdated through powercreep. WotC left us with probably 150 or so competitive pieces. Probably half of the Vset pieces are competitive, and the rest are still stronger than most of the WotC pieces. After 5 vsets, that's another 150+ competitive pieces from the Vsets. So if you look at a handful of random WotC pieces and a handful of random Vset pieces, the Vset pieces will look *far* superior. That's because the Vsets are balanced to WotC's competitive pieces, not to the rest of the weaker WotC pieces. For that reason, some people have complained because the Vsets are not necessarily friendly for a casual game if players expect the Vsets to blend in seamlessly with the weaker WotC pieces.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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what is powercreep?
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 8/9/2009 Posts: 1,935
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Power creep is the belief that as a game progresses newer figures overpower and obsolete older figures.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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Is it the belief of most SWM gamers that this has happened or is happening? Could the most successful squads from the first couple of tournaments hold their own against v-set teams at 100, 150 and 200?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010 Posts: 3,562 Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
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I think power creep was rampant in SWM from 2004 to 2007/8 - since then it's levelled out quite a bit - there's enough to change the "meta" each set, but not really a whole lot of new obsolescence going on. On the other hand, some pieces have been bought back from obsolescence, like Universe Kyle Katarn winning a Regional this year with Jan Ors. Only a small handful of pieces from early sets still see competitive play (eg General Veers, R2-D2 Astromech, Mon Mothma, Darth Sidious) while a lot of pieces from 2007-2008 sets like Knights of the Old Republic and Legacy of the Force are still good. A lot of the pieces from earlier sets were good when they were released, but have since been replaced by more modern pieces - eg Boba Fett Bounty Hunter and Clone Strike Aurra Sing were strong shooters back in their day, but the GMA, double, twin pieces Dash Renegade Smuggler, Captain Rex, and Cad Bane superseded them. According to http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/19476462/The_Evolution_of_the_Star_Wars_Miniatures_Metagame?pg=1 this squad was a solid option in after Rebel Storm in 2004: 60 Darth Vader Sith Lord 40 Emperor Palpatine There's no way it would stand up to something like General Grievous, Droid Army Commander/IG-88, Assassin Droid (both Wizards pieces). Not that two piece squads are normal at 100 points, but it seemed like a convenient comparison.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 9/1/2008 Posts: 818 Location: Wisconsin
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FlyingArrow wrote:The SWM community now exists as: http://bloomilk.com : This site. Probably the most active discussion forums. Plus it has the squadbuilder and database of every piece. http://www.swmresources.com/ : This site hosts the most important downloads. It has the PDFs of all the Vsets (the releases since WotC discontinued the game), the rules, VASSAL downloads (for online play), and the visual map list (including all the great maps by Mapmaker and JediCartographer/AdventurersAtlas). http://swmgamers.com : This site is in some sense the 'official' site because this is where the discussions about Vset development and (presumably) GenCon organization take place, but it's relatively difficult to navigate and most of the important discussions are hidden in private forums. I think it also has most of the downloads that swmresources has, but if so it's not as easy to find as it is on swmresources.com. And: www.swminiverse.com
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Rank: Moderator Groups: Member
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Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 8,428
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Chargers wrote:FlyingArrow wrote:The SWM community now exists as: http://bloomilk.com : This site. Probably the most active discussion forums. Plus it has the squadbuilder and database of every piece. http://www.swmresources.com/ : This site hosts the most important downloads. It has the PDFs of all the Vsets (the releases since WotC discontinued the game), the rules, VASSAL downloads (for online play), and the visual map list (including all the great maps by Mapmaker and JediCartographer/AdventurersAtlas). http://swmgamers.com : This site is in some sense the 'official' site because this is where the discussions about Vset development and (presumably) GenCon organization take place, but it's relatively difficult to navigate and most of the important discussions are hidden in private forums. I think it also has most of the downloads that swmresources has, but if so it's not as easy to find as it is on swmresources.com. And: www.swminiverse.com Sorry for the oversight... I don't listen to the podcasts. Maybe I should. SWMiniverse is a podcast. SHNN = Sith Holo Network News, which is another podcast. Someone will likely soon post the link for that one as well.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/26/2008 Posts: 1,233
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Sith Holo New networkAnd here is the link for SHNN
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/14/2008 Posts: 2,063
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darthbinks1 wrote:what is powercreep? Political joke incoming: Powercreep: See Anthony Wiener /End Political Joke.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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well played.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 5/14/2008 Posts: 2,063
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darthbinks1 wrote:well played. Sorry for a deviation from the actual useful meat of this thread. It seemed a fitting punch line. Anyway, back to the helpful dialogue already in progress. Common acronyms and nicknames to be aware of: Doombot: R2 Astromech, Revenge of the Sith WotC GARY: Grand Admiral Rulf Yage, VSet Black and Blue: Any squad featuring any Vader (Black) and any Thrawn (Blue) Hate Squad: Squad utilized for the sole purpose of beating a specific squad type. CritDu: Mace Windu, Legacy of the Lightside V-Set: named due to his ability to score crits at a 15% chance per Attack among other things Just a few other things to add to your growing knowledge.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/2/2012 Posts: 746
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Here are a couple more:
Uggie: Ugnaught Demolitionist Poggle Bombs: Geonosian Drones powered up by the V-Set piece Poggle the Lesser Mitthrawn: Thrawn, Mit'thraw'nuruodo GGDAC: General Grievous, Droid Army Commander Stealth and Blue: Any squad based around a big shooter with Stealth and a Thrawn Nom Bombs: A Yuuzhan Vong squad focused around a bunch of cheap Stealth pieces and Nom Anor
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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These are all very helpful, thanks.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/28/2013 Posts: 548
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Can a shooter with accurate shot target an enemy if they are not the nearest enemy and have cover? Same question for sniper.
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