The beauty (and I use that term loosely!) of Joe's Frostycon squad is that it can function as a Charging squad and a Blast Bug squad. That's why it's so strong.

As far as what can beat vong? I think there are lots of things that match up at least decently well with it.

First lets talk about squad types.

1. You need a good movement breaker (or 2) in order to keep up with the speed of the vong and the range of blast bug. Most squads already have a movement breaker (R2, Swap, Kelborn, Levitate, etc)

2. You need people that can take out a vong warrior in 1 attack. Again lots of squads have this as well (Rex, SkyGuy, Mara, Han, Dash, Embo, etc) Most squads have 1 or more than people that can do it.

3. High Volume shots if you plan on shooting through evade (Daala swarm, Echani, etc). Very few squads have this type of build.

4. Lots of Door control since the vong squad has only 2 pieces with fire jelly . Any squad with lobot can easily bring in more door control, lots of others already have it in the main squad.

5. Disruptive. Since blast bug is range 6, disruptive is decent although they get razorbug as well and disruptive doesn't shut down shaper so they can still run in and try to kill the disruptor or throw razorbugs from a distance to try and wear him down.


Now onto squad types from the past that should do reasonably well against the vong swarm.
1. Skybuck. As mentioned by lots of people already. Lots of movement, and can kill a vong on each attack with skyguy and yoda each doing 60 and whichever your 3rd guy is also being able to kill one. Decent HP and swap should kkeep your guys alive in order to wear down the vong. They do get to steal swap so it isn't a cakewalk as they can try and chase you down as well.

2. Old school Solo charge should do ok as well. 60 damage from Han with cunning can whittle guys down from a distance and up close cancels the evade. Mara can kill guys as well (2 if they bunch up at all for you). Ganner gives you some good movement and Lobot should give you enough door control to make it at least a match.

3. Revan/X swap. Ben's old Ravan Krayt squad should be able to work the vong over as it has greater range, revan kills one with cunning and krayt can kill one also. Other builds of Revan should work decently as well.

4. Talon KArrde -- Jim already has said how he would rework his squad taking into account the vong. In hindsight, I was surprised Jim didn't have morrigan already as I Assumed we would see lots of tank type squads (especially Obiken)

5. Lancer -- in almost any of its form, either single or double or Durge. Just as great of range and flying over then back will kill almost all the vong it flys over.

6. Smug Commandos -- Daniels old Gencon squad should also have a good matchup. Good movement, enough disruptive, the ability to do kill them in one go, better door control, etc

7. Mandos -- I think the squad weeks ran would do quite well against them, and Tim almost beat Joe at Frosty (5 pts).

8. Marn -- the ability to turn 4 of your guys into blast bug guys make for a very tough match for the vong, no matter what the rest of your squad does, assuming it has at least some of the above elements.



There are other things and squads that I can think of that would be decent against the Vong. Joe pegged the meta perfectly and there were almost none of the Vongs natural counters there.

I do agree that the squad is strong, and I think that it is almost the perfect representation of the squad type people have said they wanted. It is very balanced.

Correct, but the build in question doesn't have access to it. Because the subaltern isn't in to main build you can't bring them both in. And if you have the subaltern main it means you have 2 less warriors which makes it less of a problem

can it be a regular shovel? I don't want to have to get a tetanus shot when Joe uses the Yammosk to steal said shovel and beat ME with it.

Beat the Vong?? No, no, no. Just shake the hand of the Vong player (congratulating them on the victory) and move along.
Jason...you didn't read the script.

Only time I felt bad about playing the Vong was seeing the look on Étienne's face as he read the squad cards.
Baaaaaad match-up for him.

One specific squad that would do well is vindicated plus the training sergeant with covert ops who gives vindicated parry.

Wouldn't Aves be a good counter to the Blast bug swarms? Build a squad around Talon, Aves and Embo and you've got a effective squad I think.

-Karrde Trick Regional Squad--
42 Embo
32 Talon Karrde, Information Broker
31 Morrigan Corde
29 Aves, communications Officer
28 Mira of Nar Shaddaa
21 Marn Hierogryph
8 R7 Astromech Droid
3 Rodian Brute
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2

(200pts. 10 activations)

Marn can steal a Domain Lah Warrior, Aves can shut down the unlimited range of the Blast bug CE or the Evade CE depending on the situation. Aves also forces the vong player to activate 2 per turn instead of 1. Mira and Morrigan can each take out a Warrior and Embo can take out the Warrior Caste Subcommander when it comes within range to give out his Blastbug CE. Probably you could add a bunch more activations be taking out Mira and getting a lesser attacker in there, but it can get to 13 activations right now with Marn bringing in some Rodian Brutes.

EDIT: retract this. Vong stealing the ability to use 2 bugs per turn might be too much. But it would still be worth a playtest to find out. Tele Insight can't do anything with all the other CEs as "Black Sun" is not a faction.

What about something like this, it's not 100% pure vong hate, but I think it could work.

--accurate nades--
55 Xizor, Head of Black Sun
24 Togorian Black Sun Vigo
20 Captain Tarpals
20 Dug Black Sun Vigo
9 R2-D2, Astromech Droid
54 Klatooinian Black Sun Thug x9
15 Rodian Diplomat x3
3 Mouse Droid

Screen them off with diplomats and throw accurate range 12, 30 damage nades at them. Can't avoid them and crabs only save 10 damage. 2 nades = 1 DL Warrior dead with a little luck. Rolling out of the nades is a 35% chance with their +4 to saves. In cover DLWs are 19 D. With a 3 attack from the klats you need a 16 or better, that's a 25% chance of hitting for 10 then compound evade and crabs. I think the nades are the best way to go.