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You do understand where the mistake happened, right? Bane should've gotten adjacent (where was Ganner) to put the hurt on Palpatine. Ideally, 1 or 2 hits had already stuck before that situation occurs. And really, Cad Bane is not the NR's best solution for Sidous. Good ol' Mara Jade Jedi puts the hurt on him. Combo'd with some NTMTO and Disruptive (assuming Thrawn is in the mix), and Sidious can have a very bad time of it.
When more than 2 people start showing evidence, then people will start listening.
EDIT: And I laugh at any attempts to tell me that Mara Jade is no longer a competitive piece. Was she out of favor the past year, perhaps. But I see nothing in NR that doesn't allow her to still be an option.
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For those that are opposed to the BHC pieces, would you post the full builds used in your games against them? I'd like to see how the pieces are being used so I may better understand you PoV. Thanks.
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Ewok swarm beats Luke... just ask the Teddy Graham Kid.
Seriously, as a protector, my impression running the pieces was that they fell into the typical 'all your eggs in one basket' squads. The better players coming to the table didn't seem to have much trouble beating them. I agree with the poster who said Tim's Stealth N Blue squad could handle either one of these. I played against Luke with my GenCon championship squad. (Thrawn swap with Cad Bane and 2 Wookiee Thugs) I used Cad as bait in the second round and after my opponent killed him with Luke, I used the wookiees and Pellaeon to kill Luke before round 2 was over. It wasn't a squad built to deal with these pieces specifically but it won anyway. Oh, and as I recall, Cad put 20 on Luke...the rest was melee damage.
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thereisnotry wrote:My squad against the BH Challenge pieces at Gencon (I played vs Sidious) was Vong with a Quednak, Shedao Shai, 2 JHs, a Hunter, and backup. It utterly stomped the Sidious squad in 15 minutes. There ya go. The Vong destroy Sid, not to mention basing him with a shooter like Cad. The meta is wide open right now which means that certain squads and pieces are going to be super effective against others, but that also means that each piece has a glaring and exploitable weakness. Will/Can Sid and Luke be used effectively and maybe even win some big tourneys? Sure, but like Scott said at the beginning of the thread, they're 100 points they're supposed to be good. Will they dominate? Nope, too many other competitive options to stop them. I'd file this style of piece under the NPE umbrella.
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saber1 wrote:For those that are opposed to the BHC pieces, would you post the full builds used in your games against them? I'd like to see how the pieces are being used so I may better understand you PoV. Thanks. He did post one potential worrisome combo, with the undying Felucian bodyguards. But with the vast array of getting past both Bodyguard and CEs, it isn't something that is a major concern at the moment. We will see what happens and see how the meta evolves. I think V4 and V5 will have enough answers, that it shouldn't be a major issue.
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Darth_Jim wrote:Ewok swarm beats Luke... just ask the Teddy Graham Kid.
Seriously, as a protector, my impression running the pieces was that they fell into the typical 'all your eggs in one basket' squads. The better players coming to the table didn't seem to have much trouble beating them. I agree with the poster who said Tim's Stealth N Blue squad could handle either one of these. I played against Luke with my GenCon championship squad. (Thrawn swap with Cad Bane and 2 Wookiee Thugs) I used Cad as bait in the second round and after my opponent killed him with Luke, I used the wookiees and Pellaeon to kill Luke before round 2 was over. It wasn't a squad built to deal with these pieces specifically but it won anyway. Oh, and as I recall, Cad put 20 on Luke...the rest was melee damage.
Where was a piece to bodyguard the damage for luke... when as you said you have all your eggs in one basket you ahve to protect that piece, one good bodyguard and you lost that game, once the wookies came in to attack and luke takes 0 while attacking back it is game over. Like I have been saying there are a ton of potential squads to be ran, and wanted some of the people in the community with a mind better then mine to maybe find any combos that will be hard and maybe to good.
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The more I think about it, the more it seems like the Mandos have the best opportunity to handle these pieces. Some strong shooters that you can use to gang up on them. The strongest Mandos will be shooting Luke 4 times, making his MOTF less of an issue. They have Deathshots and Self Destruct. They have Bodyguard shots, which will make Vindicated very tough to deal with. The sheer variety of what the Mandos can bring against these two pieces just makes it extremely rough. Heck, spamming some Mando Crusaders for Crack Shot to make sure some big hits connect before they get close will be rough.
Vong of course will have them for breakfast.
They seems strong, yes. But there are a lot of ways to deal with them if you look.
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Sithborg wrote:saber1 wrote:For those that are opposed to the BHC pieces, would you post the full builds used in your games against them? I'd like to see how the pieces are being used so I may better understand you PoV. Thanks. He did post one potential worrisome combo, with the undying Felucian bodyguards. But with the vast array of getting past both Bodyguard and CEs, it isn't something that is a major concern at the moment. We will see what happens and see how the meta evolves. I think V4 and V5 will have enough answers, that it shouldn't be a major issue. I won an event at Gencon with Felucian's and Shamans. That squad is incredibly difficult to play, the only reason I did well with it was due to their being no movement breakers and Echo and I missplaying a rule we both forgot about. Felucians and Luke shouldn't be an issue when something as simple as Momow Nadon can hit the Shaman and kill the felucians in a single phase. Having to keep a shaman safe, keep a Felucian next to Luke, and still be able to move Luke to Attack is a lot to do when your only activating 2 pieces per round. I'll reserve judgement on these guys till they show they can stand up in a big tourney and hold serve. The TN event early next month will be a good indication.
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Yeah, like I said, there are a LOT of ways around either his CE and Bodyguard. Add in Accurate to negate the Force Ability, it ends up being weaker than it looks in concept.
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Luke, dodonna, 3 felucians, 2 shamans, door control. And either more acts or thr great dr. E. You can surely design a squad specifically to beat it, but it will be hard as balls to beat
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shmi15 wrote:Luke, dodonna, 3 felucians, 2 shamans, door control. And either more acts or thr great dr. E. You can surely design a squad specifically to beat it, but it will be hard as balls to beat \ Annoying, sure. Hard, not necessarily. How does that hold up when his CE is suppressed? What happens when Momaw Nadon is placed in a position to stop the Force Ability? Or even better, Kaan? These are not counters, but stuff that sees play now.
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The problem I see is keeping a 100 point piece alive long enough to get 100 points of value out of it. To that end, I put this together. Activations suck, but plenty of longevity for Luke. Theoretically.
--BHC Luke 2.0--
100 Luke Skywalker, Master of the Order
33 Jacen Solo, Jedi Knight
30 Vergere
25 Dannik Jerriko, Bounty Hunter
12 Ugnaught Demolitionist x4
(200pts. 8 activations)
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saber1 wrote:The problem I see is keeping a 100 point piece alive Lonny enough to get 100 points of value out of it. To that end, I put this together.
--BHC Luke 2.0--
100 Luke Skywalker, Master of the Order
33 Jacen Solo, Jedi Knight
30 Vergere
25 Dannik Jerriko, Bounty Hunter
12 Ugnaught Demolitionist x4
(200pts. 8 activations)
Yeah, that was nearly the exact squad I lost to. Annoying. I forgot about Vergere's Sever Force, and she nabbed Revan with it. Luckily, Kaan killed her with Thought Bomb.
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Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense?
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Sithborg, did your opponent Coral Implant Luke or Jacen?
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saber1 wrote:Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense? I don't think Thought Bomb can be cancelled.
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saber1 wrote:Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense? No. And she gave VCA to Luke.
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Galactic Funk wrote:saber1 wrote:Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense? I don't think Thought Bomb can be cancelled. What is the reasoning?
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saber1 wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:saber1 wrote:Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense? I don't think Thought Bomb can be cancelled. What is the reasoning? Force 5, replaces turn or when this character is defeated: 80 damage to all living characters within 6 squares; save 11 to reduce damage to 40. Remove this character from play. This Force power cannot be canceled.
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juice man wrote:saber1 wrote:Galactic Funk wrote:saber1 wrote:Assuming he has the FPs when it counts, can't Luke neuter Kaan's bomb with Force Defense? I don't think Thought Bomb can be cancelled. What is the reasoning? Force 5, replaces turn or when this character is defeated: 80 damage to all living characters within 6 squares; save 11 to reduce damage to 40. Remove this character from play. This Force power cannot be canceled. That's what I get for not reading the ENTIRE text. Phail!
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