OK, by that logic we should make Naboo troopers Rebel, since they were rebels during the Rebellion of Theed.

There's more to a faction than throwing every conceivable character into it that fits on a name-only basis. To lump all the various Sith ideologies together as being united is to oversimplify to a unreasonable degree.

More parallels can be drawn among the idealogies of OR, Rep, and NR than can be drawn among all the ideologies represented by the characters who have orange cards (to even call them a faction in any respect other than gameplay is to take the game as it is as how it always had to be)

I'm just downloading the SHHN now.

I can see both sides of the argument. However I have to agree with Dreadtech and the others in the minority.
Was or was not Darth Sidious and Darth Vader the 2 Sith Lords Who followed Banes rule of two. Sidious was the only Sith lord to pull it all together, using the republic(Imperial) system to turn it from within. For 20 years, there were 2 Sith Lords(according to GL cannon). As states the Sith run from the old days of the Sith empire all the way to the Legacy era.
I can see both sides though. I just hope that on the SHNN, both sides of the argument are defended. Sometimes, as much as I love the show, All the guys are of the same mindset, with only one side of a certain topic being defended. I love the show though and I hope no one takes offense.

Two things. First, Vader did not follow the rule of two.

Second, on occasion we take different sides of an issue, but we decided long ago to generally go with what our honest opinions are - even if that means we agree and we have to argue with an unrepresented counterpoint.

Can we get a voting box up for this question? :)

I have only skimmed the thread and read some of the recent responses, so I may well be repeating things that have already been said.

My opinion is that there should NOT be a Sith Vader in the game.

My further opinion, though, is that had WotC continued, they WOULD have eventually made a Sith Vader.

There are a number of issues tied to this, the key one being the nature of a faction in the Star Wars miniatures game (which is NOT the same as a faction in the fictional world of Star Wars). The issue of faction is further complicated by confusing nature of the Sith faction itself.

My thinking is this, though: in SWM, faction represents allegiance. Although Vader's title included the word "Sith" and he served under a Sith lord, his loyalty never appears to be to the greater ideals of the Sith, so much as to the oppressive government of the Empire. True, the Empire is just a tool of the Sith lord Sidious, but the same is true of the Seps and of Vader himself, so those arguing that the Empire is really just an extension of the Sith faction might as well argue that the Rep/Old Rep/NR should also be the same faction.

For the record, I think that there SHOULD be a Sith Dooku, by the way, and that gets to some of what makes Vader NOT a Sith in SWM terms. Arguably, what ties all the Sith in the SWM Sith faction together is that they are, for lack of a better term, "rebels".... luciferian rebels, even. From Exar Kun and Darth Revan, through Bane and Sidious, up to Lumiya and Krayt, all are rebelling against the "law of the land." Some operate in shadows, others brazenly; some, like Sidious, subvert the system for their own purposes, but ALL of them are basically "criminals" in a legal and philosophical sense.

Vader? Not so. Unlike the others, he SERVES the law of the land. He is always a tool of the Empire, even if that means he is also, by extension, a tool of the Emperor. (Arguably, Darth Caedus also fits this mold, but that's a discussion for another day.)

I say nay!!

From mine point of view it's like this: we don't have to follow up the footsteps of the thing which WotC screwed up! Sidous Holo, Maul, and others are just wrong. So why the heck should we make the same mistakes?

Once and for all- of course, Vader was a Sith but we have to remeber that in that period being Sith meant being Imperial!! So he's an Imp. character. Even if he was a dark lord.

Shouldn't Sith fraction look for other backup rather than for the next beatstick?? I mean come on, think about it.

I've been scratching my head at how people cannot see that he should be in the Sith, when he is sith.
I always scrathed my head as to why he WAS not in a sith squad.
So as a child this how i saw it and still do, so here goes

Palpatine was a Sith Master, with numerous apprenticees.
He had his super powerful Sith Apprentice Darth Vader, who gets badly injured and stuck in forever in his servitude.
Palps who is a Sith lord rules over his galaxy from afar and only comes out when his pet sith drops the ball.
Lord Vader the Dark Lord of the Sith runs around with the Imperial army using them at the call of his master (plus secretly for his own gain)

So the whole imperial side of it is a front for the Sith who by the end ruled not so secretly as Sith over the galaxy.


Then wizzies comes along and makes a great game without really having a game plan and we're stuck with wrong sounding muppets.

Okay, Darth Vader is an ambiguous situation if you look at the whole picture in only one way. In my personal opinion Darth Vader should be allowed into the Sith faction due to the fact that the Galactic Empire is a separate entity entirely from a Sith Empire because My definition of a Sith Empire is when a populace willingly follows the rule of a leader who has Openly Declared Himself/Herself Sith. As far as I know, Palpatine never announced to the public that he was a Sith Master. In fact, he even passed on the opportunity after he killed Mace Windu by claiming he was scarred by the experience. He didn’t say, “Oh by the way, the only reason jedI attacked me is because I am a Sith Lord.”. This situation makes it clear in my mind that the Galactic Empire was a none-Sith government. Likewise, the government after Darth Caedus’ open declaration of being a Sith, in my mind, is a Sith Empire, although short in length.

Darth Vader is a Sith, from a certain point of view.

But Vader only existed within the political context of the Empire.

Yes, it was at it's core a 'Sith' Empire, but no one but a few understood that. Vader was a reluctant Sith. He chose the Sith as a means to an end (saving Padme), and I doubt he had much loyalty to the order (see various acts of betrayal in TFU, ESB, ROTJ etc). He hated Palpatine for duping him.

Also, Palpatine and Vader did not openly rule the galaxy as declared Sith Lords, they kept their true nature secret. They don't really follow the same character traits as say Revan and Malak.

As has been said, a case can be made for Holosid being in the Sith faction. That iteration of Sidious existed outside of the time of the Separatist movement, thus he is correctly Sith. Maul should never have been a Sep, he died before they existed. So I can live with them. The New Sith (Krayt, Nihl, Talon) needed to go somewhere, and Sith was really the only choice, but they don't fit really well. Lumiya, Caedus and Darth Sidious Sith Master DO NOT belong in that faction IMO.

Vader has no business being teamed with Sith Troopers etc. He served the Empire, I think it's fairly clear that his loyalty was always to the Empire and to himself, not his master.

I could have live with a pre-suit Sith Vader, I would have hated it, but I could have lived with it I guess. BUt twe've had 2 of them, and Wizos made them Imperial, not Sith.

No, please no. It would be wrong.

There is an Old Republic faction.

And Anakin was a jedi under the Old Republic and we have an Old Republic faction

Time for an OR Anakin!