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EmporerDragon wrote:Jedi_Master wrote:If it is used at all it would be in a situation I can not think of. When the enemy is across a pit When activating the character is more beneficial than damaging it When the desired target is being screened by other units When the enemy's defense is high enough that the save has a better chance at damage Across a pit? I guess but I can not think of many maps where 16 movement isn't enough to get around. Isn't killing a character better than a 50/50 chance of activating it? The unit ignores characters while moving, it would have to be an 8 unit screen. Base attack of 12 with bounty hunter and no support. Very few units have over a 23 defense VS adjacent.
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Jedi_Master wrote:EmporerDragon wrote:Jedi_Master wrote:If it is used at all it would be in a situation I can not think of. When the enemy is across a pit When activating the character is more beneficial than damaging it When the desired target is being screened by other units When the enemy's defense is high enough that the save has a better chance at damage Across a pit? I guess but I can not think of many maps where 16 movement isn't enough to get around. Isn't killing a character better than a 50/50 chance of activating it? The unit ignores characters while moving, it would have to be an 8 unit screen. Base attack of 12 with bounty hunter and no support. Very few units have over a 23 defense VS adjacent. What if attacking means you don't kill it? Yes, it is actually very common that activating a character is better than attacking it. I've won a LOT of games on the virtue of activating an opponent's big piece. Abilities that activate are probably the most undervalued abilities by inexperienced players. There are also plenty of times where you could attack by, say, basing the enemy and just shooting them, but you really don't want to. Say you're within 6 squares of any cloaked figure but not adjacent to it. Basing it might not kill it, or basing it puts you in bad positioning and you'll lose Embo by doing so (trading Embo for a Mando Scout or Storm Commando is a pretty terrible trade). Instead you could use Hat Toss to do some damage, have a chance to activate it (again, HUGE), and then move 8 squares away to safety! This is not an unrealistic situation by any means. Will you use hat toss more often or even as often as attacking? No. But if you can't think of a situation that it would be used in you're either not trying or frankly not very experienced, because I can think of plenty of situations where I would prefer it to attacking.
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Echo24 wrote:What if attacking means you don't kill it? Yes, it is actually very common that activating a character is better than attacking it. I've won a LOT of games on the virtue of activating an opponent's big piece. Abilities that activate are probably the most undervalued abilities by inexperienced players.
There are also plenty of times where you could attack by, say, basing the enemy and just shooting them, but you really don't want to. Say you're within 6 squares of any cloaked figure but not adjacent to it. Basing it might not kill it, or basing it puts you in bad positioning and you'll lose Embo by doing so (trading Embo for a Mando Scout or Storm Commando is a pretty terrible trade). Instead you could use Hat Toss to do some damage, have a chance to activate it (again, HUGE), and then move 8 squares away to safety! This is not an unrealistic situation by any means.
Will you use hat toss more often or even as often as attacking? No. But if you can't think of a situation that it would be used in you're either not trying or frankly not very experienced, because I can think of plenty of situations where I would prefer it to attacking. So, to summarize, it won't be used very often, attacking would be better if you can kill the enemy and you won't get killed in return (remember, 60 base damage and potential to get him up to and possibly over 100 in a squad, isn't stopped by other units and can move 16 and attack, all HUGE too), and yet it is worth it because it has a 50/50 chance of activating a big piece so long as it isn't a force user and is within 6 and you can move away. So blue moon on sunday at noon is what you're saying. Yes, activating a unit can be useful, very much so if it is, say, Kaan who is in range for a thought bomb or yobuck who is about to charge. But what do you need HIM to have the ability for? It reminds me of sidious DLotS. Yeah, he CAN do something but his ability to do it increases his cost to a point where it makes him less useful. Do I want to spend 42 points on a character who can charge in for 100 damage or activate 2 units on his turn (statistically 1), maybe. Do I want him to just do one or the other and cost a bit less, hell yeah. Did he need a new ability that will likely never be on another mini? Not really. Give him jolt with a czerka if you want to activate a unit (oh, wait, I suddenly have to think about how to defend it and it can be picked off, oh shame and horror. Guess you have to have experience with the game to think about that though, eh?) or just don't use him and use a cheaper unit like jareal who can also dish out damage to activate people. So, is it another ability that got thrown in the set or is it something unique and useful that the future v-sets can build off of? (again, I like ideas like padawan, this though...) Was it necessary to add to the piece or was the fact that it was non-melee with twin enough? Did it add to the units cost and will be rarely used or was it something valuable that can be relied on? Is it similar to other existing abilities (a little worse/better) or is it different? That is what I am asking and what I am questioning on most of these new abilities. Yeah, even grenades 10 on a Bothan Spy can be useful. Was it really needed and worth the increase in cost though?
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There are things that have been done by the V-set designers that I'm not thrilled with so I understand your point. However, WotC did many things I didn't like but I played the game because I enjoyed the overall experience. You are making some good points and some that seem overly critical. I suggest you do as I did and recognize that the pieces are being designed for broad appeal. By definition that means its not for, and cannot ever be, for universal appeal or perfection. No one like every piece. But with Embo, the hat toss mechanic gives him utility which cannot help but be beneficial. It's also accurate to the character. If his hat, a significant part of the character, was ignored, there would be players complaining about its absence. It's fun, accurate and useful so why not use it? Or not.
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From what I see, Embo only does 50 base damage. With 90hp and DR10, not many pieces will kill him in one turn, so I kind of agree - way more often than not, it's more useful to move the extra 8 with Charging Assault and attack while adjacent.
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Echo24 wrote:
What if attacking means you don't kill it? Yes, it is actually very common that activating a character is better than attacking it. I've won a LOT of games on the virtue of activating an opponent's big piece. Abilities that activate are probably the most undervalued abilities by inexperienced players.
My point exactly. It's far better to nickel and dime your enemy to death with minimal reprisal than to charge in and slug it out, hoping for the best. Embo should not be using his Charging Assault like it was his only move in his arsenal; it should be primarily used as a finisher. As if you don't kill the enemy unit, Embo's going to bite it, hard, as he's only got 90 HP and 19 defense to stand up to a now-wounded, angry jedi. One other nice thing about Hat Toss, it's mere existence is good as just the threat of it means that your opponent cannot put his important pieces adjacent to each other and will use suboptimal positioning.
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saber1 wrote:If his hat, a significant part of the character, was ignored, there would be players complaining about its absence. So, so true. "If WotC put a $20 bill inside of each booster players would complain about how it was folded."
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Jedi_Master wrote:Echo24 wrote:What if attacking means you don't kill it? Yes, it is actually very common that activating a character is better than attacking it. I've won a LOT of games on the virtue of activating an opponent's big piece. Abilities that activate are probably the most undervalued abilities by inexperienced players.
There are also plenty of times where you could attack by, say, basing the enemy and just shooting them, but you really don't want to. Say you're within 6 squares of any cloaked figure but not adjacent to it. Basing it might not kill it, or basing it puts you in bad positioning and you'll lose Embo by doing so (trading Embo for a Mando Scout or Storm Commando is a pretty terrible trade). Instead you could use Hat Toss to do some damage, have a chance to activate it (again, HUGE), and then move 8 squares away to safety! This is not an unrealistic situation by any means.
Will you use hat toss more often or even as often as attacking? No. But if you can't think of a situation that it would be used in you're either not trying or frankly not very experienced, because I can think of plenty of situations where I would prefer it to attacking. So, to summarize, it won't be used very often, attacking would be better if you can kill the enemy and you won't get killed in return (remember, 60 base damage and potential to get him up to and possibly over 100 in a squad, isn't stopped by other units and can move 16 and attack, all HUGE too), and yet it is worth it because it has a 50/50 chance of activating a big piece so long as it isn't a force user and is within 6 and you can move away. So blue moon on sunday at noon is what you're saying. Yes, activating a unit can be useful, very much so if it is, say, Kaan who is in range for a thought bomb or yobuck who is about to charge. But what do you need HIM to have the ability for? It reminds me of sidious DLotS. Yeah, he CAN do something but his ability to do it increases his cost to a point where it makes him less useful. Do I want to spend 42 points on a character who can charge in for 100 damage or activate 2 units on his turn (statistically 1), maybe. Do I want him to just do one or the other and cost a bit less, hell yeah. Did he need a new ability that will likely never be on another mini? Not really. Give him jolt with a czerka if you want to activate a unit (oh, wait, I suddenly have to think about how to defend it and it can be picked off, oh shame and horror. Guess you have to have experience with the game to think about that though, eh?) or just don't use him and use a cheaper unit like jareal who can also dish out damage to activate people. So, is it another ability that got thrown in the set or is it something unique and useful that the future v-sets can build off of? (again, I like ideas like padawan, this though...) Was it necessary to add to the piece or was the fact that it was non-melee with twin enough? Did it add to the units cost and will be rarely used or was it something valuable that can be relied on? Is it similar to other existing abilities (a little worse/better) or is it different? That is what I am asking and what I am questioning on most of these new abilities. Yeah, even grenades 10 on a Bothan Spy can be useful. Was it really needed and worth the increase in cost though? The thing is just having the option is SO much better then only having the charge for 50 damage. Yes, Embo's crazy range is his biggest quality by far, but just having the option to use a different form of attack puts him miles ahead of other one dementional pieces. Unless I'm certain I can kill the piece I send Embo after in that phase or very soon thereafter I'll be using Hat Toss. Doing 50 damage then losing your 40 point investment because he gets punked by an enemy jedi is a very poor trade. However using an activation power not only gives you a 50% chance to take a piece out of the round but if you get jedi burning force points on rerolls thats also a win. Hat Toss is very very strong against pieces like Zannah and Gowk. THey either have to burn force to reroll (or bubble in zannah's case) or they take damage AND don't get the benefits of activating, like doing damage and getting force renewal. I wouldnt write it off completely just yet.
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EmporerDragon wrote:Jedi_Master wrote:If it is used at all it would be in a situation I can not think of. When the enemy is across a pit When activating the character is more beneficial than damaging it When the desired target is being screened by other units When the enemy's defense is high enough that the save has a better chance at damage when you just cant get close enough to actually get a shot off on a cloaked character. WHen you have exar force spirit within 6.
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People seem to have gotten off the topic at hand...so I will reiterate
"So, is it another ability that got thrown in the set or is it something unique and useful that the future v-sets can build off of? (again, I like ideas like padawan, this though...) Was it necessary to add to the piece or was the fact that it was non-melee with twin enough? Did it add to the units cost and will be rarely used or was it something valuable that can be relied on? Is it similar to other existing abilities (a little worse/better) or is it different? That is what I am asking and what I am questioning on most of these new abilities. Yeah, even grenades 10 on a Bothan Spy can be useful. Was it really needed and worth the increase in cost though?"
Is hat trick unique, yes. Was non melee with twin and damage reduction a good way to represent the piece without saying "hat trick", yes (though close combat expert might have been good for him). Did it add to the units cost, yes. Can it be relied upon to have uses on a regular basis, not really (and the reaching people are doing to try and support it seem to exemplify that. Yes, lets charge in a 40+ point unit to combat a unit that it can not kill in one round but can kill it in one round. That is called bad movement, not a justification for an ability that leaves you in melee range anyway.) Is it similar to existing abilities, yes, and other existing abilities on other characters can offer the stunning effect when paired with them, increasing other units usefulness.
I can make similar comments about Spinning Blade Attack, Ruthless, Zenji Needle (poison dart by another name is just as sweet), and Muur Talisman
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Jedi_Master wrote:People seem to have gotten off the topic at hand...so I will reiterate
"So, is it another ability that got thrown in the set or is it something unique and useful that the future v-sets can build off of? (again, I like ideas like padawan, this though...) Was it necessary to add to the piece or was the fact that it was non-melee with twin enough? Did it add to the units cost and will be rarely used or was it something valuable that can be relied on? Is it similar to other existing abilities (a little worse/better) or is it different? That is what I am asking and what I am questioning on most of these new abilities. Yeah, even grenades 10 on a Bothan Spy can be useful. Was it really needed and worth the increase in cost though?"
Is hat trick unique, yes. Was non melee with twin and damage reduction a good way to represent the piece without saying "hat trick", yes (though close combat expert might have been good for him). Did it add to the units cost, yes. Can it be relied upon to have uses on a regular basis, not really (and the reaching people are doing to try and support it seem to exemplify that. Yes, lets charge in a 40+ point unit to combat a unit that it can not kill in one round but can kill it in one round. That is called bad movement, not a justification for an ability that leaves you in melee range anyway.) Is it similar to existing abilities, yes, and other existing abilities on other characters can offer the stunning effect when paired with them, increasing other units usefulness.
I can make similar comments about Spinning Blade Attack, Ruthless, Zenji Needle (poison dart by another name is just as sweet), and Muur Talisman so basically you are saying that new abillities that are slightly different are a bad idea. In your example you say that spinning blade attack is a bad idea. the closest thing to this is Galloping attack, which not only sounds wrong on this piece, but also works quite differently. galloping attack would get him killed in a couple runs like it does yobuck, plus it doesn't replace turn, so he would be able to get a potential 4 attacks off on one person if timed correctly. the hat trick ability is not meant to be a game changing ability. IT is meant to be a flavor part, and a limited use ability. IS that so bad to have an ability that will not be heavily used on that piece? With an example from Wotc pieces, the Vractel Wrangler has grenades. how often do you see someone decide to play him because he has grenades? adding in abilities that are not necessary is not a big issue. Does the Quednak really need plasma eel? no but it helps tremendously in certain situations. I can think of quite a few situations where i would want to activate a character so that it can be attacked with opportunist and not base him and that is one of the many uses for this ability. you say that you can make comments on certain abilities like Murr talisman, but i do not see what ability would have made sense in place of that. Yeah they are abilities that you will only see on 1 character, however WOTC did this too. HAve you seen another WOTC piece with Eternal Hatred? How about Execute Order 66? and i know they are just abusing the abilities to grant benefits to Dejarik pieces aren't they? you see WOTC did this too. So it is nothing new. They could have just Given Molatar Emergency Life support, but instead, for flavor, they gave him Protective aura. They are the same ability but they did this for flavor. They did the same thing on nearly every other Dejarik piece. But im sure if they had continued to make pieces that they would have never used those abilities again. a new ability for the sake of flavor is not anything new, and i do not think it should be discouraged. And to be honest abilities like this one are not that hard to remember the differences.
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I would like to also point out, in the case of WotC, that Electrostaff/Shockstaff precident (Jarael/IG Droid whose name escapes me) along with Force Attuned Armor/Voduun Crab Armor 11 to "different name, same idea" concept being pointed out. And yes, Voduun Crab Armor 11 and Force Attuned Armor are in line with the characters that used them and the VSet created Beskar'gam armor. So, would anyone have liked seeing Mandos in Voduun Crab Armor 11 or Force Attuned Armor? Probably not as it would cause fans' heads to explode upon the indignation that Mandos sported armor of someone else variety. Could WotC just came up with an ability like "Master Craft Armor" for the Jenserrai Defender, which would have been a save 11 but stock enough that anyone could have it in the future without batting an eye? Probably. but they didn't.
WotC opened the door for "different name, same ability."
Would the K'klor Slug (seldom used, I know) have been better with just basic DR 10 or Armored Plates (If character doesn't move, it gains DR 10 *wording escapes me but the idea is there*)? This case I would say yes but, based on it's design and the fact that the new guy took over for this set (which would make it that WotC allowed someone else to interject new ideas), it was done to give that unit flavor.
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countrydude82487 wrote:
so basically you are saying that new abillities that are slightly different are a bad idea. In your example you say that spinning blade attack is a bad idea. the closest thing to this is Galloping attack, which not only sounds wrong on this piece, but also works quite differently. galloping attack would get him killed in a couple runs like it does yobuck, plus it doesn't replace turn, so he would be able to get a potential 4 attacks off on one person if timed correctly.
the hat trick ability is not meant to be a game changing ability. IT is meant to be a flavor part, and a limited use ability. IS that so bad to have an ability that will not be heavily used on that piece? With an example from Wotc pieces, the Vractel Wrangler has grenades. how often do you see someone decide to play him because he has grenades? adding in abilities that are not necessary is not a big issue. Does the Quednak really need plasma eel? no but it helps tremendously in certain situations. I can think of quite a few situations where i would want to activate a character so that it can be attacked with opportunist and not base him and that is one of the many uses for this ability.
you say that you can make comments on certain abilities like Murr talisman, but i do not see what ability would have made sense in place of that. Yeah they are abilities that you will only see on 1 character, however WOTC did this too. HAve you seen another WOTC piece with Eternal Hatred? How about Execute Order 66? and i know they are just abusing the abilities to grant benefits to Dejarik pieces aren't they? you see WOTC did this too. So it is nothing new. They could have just Given Molatar Emergency Life support, but instead, for flavor, they gave him Protective aura. They are the same ability but they did this for flavor. They did the same thing on nearly every other Dejarik piece. But im sure if they had continued to make pieces that they would have never used those abilities again. a new ability for the sake of flavor is not anything new, and i do not think it should be discouraged. And to be honest abilities like this one are not that hard to remember the differences.
So because I dislike them on V-set minis I must have loved them on WotC minis? That....I'm sorry, I can't help but scratch my head at that logic. Are you trying to say WotC did a good job on the game? I can point to just about any member of the community and they would argue that. I also have not once said that any ability was bad, just that they were not needed and were limited in use. I would rather abilities be created with re-use in mind so we do not have more protective auras. You can have flavor without adding to the already ludicrous list of special abilities. As for the first part, pop quiz. Cesta, Atlatl, thud bug, razor bug, missiles, grenades, ion grenades, emp grenades, exploding pistols, magma pebble, sonic stunner, and stun mortar. I'll give you a hint, they all have at least two of the following; range 6, save 11, XX damage, activate adjacent to target, damage adjacent to target. One doesn't belong. Let me know how long it takes. markedman247 wrote:I would like to also point out, in the case of WotC, that Electrostaff/Shockstaff precident (Jarael/IG Droid whose name escapes me) along with Force Attuned Armor/Voduun Crab Armor 11 to "different name, same idea" concept being pointed out. And yes, Voduun Crab Armor 11 and Force Attuned Armor are in line with the characters that used them and the VSet created Beskar'gam armor. So, would anyone have liked seeing Mandos in Voduun Crab Armor 11 or Force Attuned Armor? Probably not as it would cause fans' heads to explode upon the indignation that Mandos sported armor of someone else variety. Could WotC just came up with an ability like "Master Craft Armor" for the Jenserrai Defender, which would have been a save 11 but stock enough that anyone could have it in the future without batting an eye? Probably. but they didn't.
WotC opened the door for "different name, same ability."
Would the K'klor Slug (seldom used, I know) have been better with just basic DR 10 or Armored Plates (If character doesn't move, it gains DR 10 *wording escapes me but the idea is there*)? This case I would say yes but, based on it's design and the fact that the new guy took over for this set (which would make it that WotC allowed someone else to interject new ideas), it was done to give that unit flavor.
That is a perfect case in point. Why not just "armor 11"? Yeah, kinda blah, but do you want armor 11 or VCA 11, Bes(mando thing) 11, FAA 11, damage reduction 10, Teraski style (spelled wrong I bet), defensive plates, force bubble, and anything else anybody can come up with? Yeah, flavor is great. When a new player looks at that list though, they go "huh?" and after looking two up assume the entire list is the same thing. But some have special rules, some need saves, and some ignore lightsabers. Pile on confusion for flavor, doesn't seem piratical.
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see to me it is not that confusing and i actually prefer having Beskar'gam on mandos, vonduun crab armor on vong, and dark armor on a piece like vader. I works great. Yeah they are essentially the same thing with the 6,11, and 16 variations, however they add flavor. Yeah on a vong piece you could have just put satchel charge or missiles instead of fire-jelly or Plasma eel, but to me it just doesn't sound right. Sure you may have to remember what an ability does, but it is not that confusing, especially when it is written on the card. and i honestly think, judging by the players i play with that have entered the game in the last year, that most players pick up the fact that some pieces have very similar or even the same ability renamed for flavor. ALot of people are used to games like dnd minis, and heroclix that ahve similar abillities renamed. I am not saying that this should always be done, but it is the principal. In certain instances flavor matters.
I am not saying that WOTC did Everything correctly with the game, but they did do some things right, otherwise the game would not have gotten this far. THe designers are following a specific trend that WOTC started, and i dont see an issue with this trend.
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Jedi_Master wrote:countrydude82487 wrote:
so basically you are saying that new abillities that are slightly different are a bad idea. In your example you say that spinning blade attack is a bad idea. the closest thing to this is Galloping attack, which not only sounds wrong on this piece, but also works quite differently. galloping attack would get him killed in a couple runs like it does yobuck, plus it doesn't replace turn, so he would be able to get a potential 4 attacks off on one person if timed correctly.
the hat trick ability is not meant to be a game changing ability. IT is meant to be a flavor part, and a limited use ability. IS that so bad to have an ability that will not be heavily used on that piece? With an example from Wotc pieces, the Vractel Wrangler has grenades. how often do you see someone decide to play him because he has grenades? adding in abilities that are not necessary is not a big issue. Does the Quednak really need plasma eel? no but it helps tremendously in certain situations. I can think of quite a few situations where i would want to activate a character so that it can be attacked with opportunist and not base him and that is one of the many uses for this ability.
you say that you can make comments on certain abilities like Murr talisman, but i do not see what ability would have made sense in place of that. Yeah they are abilities that you will only see on 1 character, however WOTC did this too. HAve you seen another WOTC piece with Eternal Hatred? How about Execute Order 66? and i know they are just abusing the abilities to grant benefits to Dejarik pieces aren't they? you see WOTC did this too. So it is nothing new. They could have just Given Molatar Emergency Life support, but instead, for flavor, they gave him Protective aura. They are the same ability but they did this for flavor. They did the same thing on nearly every other Dejarik piece. But im sure if they had continued to make pieces that they would have never used those abilities again. a new ability for the sake of flavor is not anything new, and i do not think it should be discouraged. And to be honest abilities like this one are not that hard to remember the differences.
So because I dislike them on V-set minis I must have loved them on WotC minis? That....I'm sorry, I can't help but scratch my head at that logic. Are you trying to say WotC did a good job on the game? I can point to just about any member of the community and they would argue that. I also have not once said that any ability was bad, just that they were not needed and were limited in use. I would rather abilities be created with re-use in mind so we do not have more protective auras. You can have flavor without adding to the already ludicrous list of special abilities. As for the first part, pop quiz. Cesta, Atlatl, thud bug, razor bug, missiles, grenades, ion grenades, emp grenades, exploding pistols, magma pebble, sonic stunner, and stun mortar. I'll give you a hint, they all have at least two of the following; range 6, save 11, XX damage, activate adjacent to target, damage adjacent to target. One doesn't belong. Let me know how long it takes. markedman247 wrote:I would like to also point out, in the case of WotC, that Electrostaff/Shockstaff precident (Jarael/IG Droid whose name escapes me) along with Force Attuned Armor/Voduun Crab Armor 11 to "different name, same idea" concept being pointed out. And yes, Voduun Crab Armor 11 and Force Attuned Armor are in line with the characters that used them and the VSet created Beskar'gam armor. So, would anyone have liked seeing Mandos in Voduun Crab Armor 11 or Force Attuned Armor? Probably not as it would cause fans' heads to explode upon the indignation that Mandos sported armor of someone else variety. Could WotC just came up with an ability like "Master Craft Armor" for the Jenserrai Defender, which would have been a save 11 but stock enough that anyone could have it in the future without batting an eye? Probably. but they didn't.
WotC opened the door for "different name, same ability."
Would the K'klor Slug (seldom used, I know) have been better with just basic DR 10 or Armored Plates (If character doesn't move, it gains DR 10 *wording escapes me but the idea is there*)? This case I would say yes but, based on it's design and the fact that the new guy took over for this set (which would make it that WotC allowed someone else to interject new ideas), it was done to give that unit flavor.
That is a perfect case in point. Why not just "armor 11"? Yeah, kinda blah, but do you want armor 11 or VCA 11, Bes(mando thing) 11, FAA 11, damage reduction 10, Teraski style (spelled wrong I bet), defensive plates, force bubble, and anything else anybody can come up with? Yeah, flavor is great. When a new player looks at that list though, they go "huh?" and after looking two up assume the entire list is the same thing. But some have special rules, some need saves, and some ignore lightsabers. Pile on confusion for flavor, doesn't seem piratical. Because that's how the game was designed. If it were to be streamlined like that it would be more like how Heroclix does their abilities. Example: Green on movement = charge, works the same whether its superman or or a street level thug using it. This game however may use two different abilities that equal pretty much the same thing (grenades, missiles, Atlal, etc). Yes, it can be confusing. If you don't know what something does you should read your opponents cards at the top of the match. "hey, this guy has Atlal. Is that like grenades" "why yes, good chap, it is." I do agree similarly named things can be annoying. I guess that's what your driving at?
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Look, I understand the dislike of having new abilities. Each new ability means more work for me. But for the most part, they are really easy to understand based on what is on the card. I understand the barrier it can cause to a returning player, but even sticking to new figs with just WOTC abilities (which is extremely limiting), we would have that with new characters.
As for the similar abilities are screwed if we do, screwed if we don't. Some people prefer the flavor over a single ability.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 6/23/2010
Posts: 3,562
Location: The Hutt, New Zealand
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Jedi_Master wrote:But some have special rules, some need saves, and some ignore lightsabers. Pile on confusion for flavor, doesn't seem piratical. I don't think variations of different abilities like Damage Reduction or Grenades/Missiles etc cause much problem in terms of rules - they're pretty simple to get your head around. I'd take the flavour anytime.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 2/25/2011
Posts: 806
Location: Wisconsin
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I vote for flavor.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 7/29/2009
Posts: 496
Location: Nebraska
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The way I see it, Embo is a silly character that my Star Wars experience could do without quite well (It's cool if you like him, I am not trying to start a fight), but he is in the universe now and the design team did a good job of representing the character. If the piece had to be made, it seems like this is the best way to go about it, to make an ability that captures his silly quirks.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 7/19/2009
Posts: 178
Location: Earth
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I like Embo, but for me he is too fragile theese days, so having DR10 and 90 HP won't help him one bit and I'm not giving my 42 points that easily. I have nothing against him having this Hat Toss- it fits the character (thank God he doesn't have hat slide- see TCW season 5 trailer :P ) and is a new ability - that's the only way this game can stay alive by adding new characters, improving old ones and by introducing new abilities. Is Hat Toss something which could break the game? No.
So what's this all fuss about?
If this set is like BH then I would like to see new versions of Zam Wessel (come on!), Aurra Sing, Bounty Hunter (not that the one from CS is bad, I still use her, but maybe give her a bunch of abilities, and plzzz make her really good, not the awful way we seen her in TCW, keep lightsaber and Jedi Hunter :)) ), Jango Fett (come on, who uses BH version?, not to mention CS), if Embo's in than maybe Sugi and Marrok as well?
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