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Prestige Worldwide wrote:I'm confused how the excuse people have for V-Sets being overwhelming is the amount of abilities in a set amount of time. Now maybe I'll come off as a troll, but I find it hard to believe that a set released every couple of months is overwhelming. If people can read books, and magazines, how is it so hard to remember abilities on a card? I think the issue is more that people don't have time to play with all of them.
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Prestige Worldwide wrote:I'm confused how the excuse people have for V-Sets being overwhelming is the amount of abilities in a set amount of time. Now maybe I'll come off as a troll, but I find it hard to believe that a set released every couple of months is overwhelming. If people can read books, and magazines, how is it so hard to remember abilities on a card? because the abilities on the cards have a lot of interactions that are possible.
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Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing
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trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Not really. There's also not a regional in DE. You know where we just started having regionals? New Zealand. 
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more divided than I was expecting.
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corranhorn wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Not really. There's also not a regional in DE. You know where we just started having regionals? New Zealand. Any chance of having a regional in DE? LeftiesWillRule organized last year's but I haven't heard from him recently.
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I don't understand when people talk about the end of SWM. I will have my pieces and play them until I die. That's 63 more years people!
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kezzamachine wrote:I don't understand when people talk about the end of SWM. I will have my pieces and play them until I die. That's 63 more years people! I imagine that they mean the end of new Vsets and/or the end of the GenCon chamionship. I expect to play this forever, too. But realistically, it only lasts as long as I can convince others to play. That's part of why I consider your idea about 'levels' so important. One way it can always survive is as a boardgame with pre-set squads. A new player can pick a thematic squad and learn it in one sitting, instead of having to learn how to build a squad and worry about meta, 1000+ pieces, etc. As far as they're concerned, the game is just their squad and the squad the opponent has.
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The primary reason I created a playgroup in NZ was so I could play this game to the grave. Secondary reason was the leg room.
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kezzamachine wrote:The primary reason I created a playgroup in NZ was so I could play this game to the grave. Secondary reason was the leg room. You should start a new thread about how you started it. Or resurrect a dead thread about it. I imagine you've talked about it before.
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corranhorn wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Not really. There's also not a regional in DE. You know where we just started having regionals? New Zealand. I used MO as an example due to the fact that it used to be a big deal, there's also the fact that there's a number of complete collections up for sell, so yes the player base is dwindling it just most likely won't ever see a large rebound atleast at a highly completive level. Sure there's now a regional in NZ but how many regionals aren't Happening this year compared to years gone by? But I don't think the game will be dying anytime soon. EDIT: as a side note there's even a couple of v-sets up for sale on ebay
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trappedslider wrote:corranhorn wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Not really. There's also not a regional in DE. You know where we just started having regionals? New Zealand. I used MO as an example due to the fact that it used to be a big deal, I know. Quote:
there's also the fact that there's a number of complete collections up for sell,
So a few players are getting out. That's too bad but ti's hardly evidence of a dwindling player base, at least on a large scale. Also, whoever buys the collections will presumably start playing, so... Quote:
so yes the player base is dwindling it just most likely won't ever see a large rebound atleast at a highly completive level. Sure there's now a regional in NZ but how many regionals aren't Happening this year compared to years gone by? But I don't think the game will be dying anytime soon.
Agreed.
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corranhorn wrote:Prestige Worldwide wrote:I'm confused how the excuse people have for V-Sets being overwhelming is the amount of abilities in a set amount of time. Now maybe I'll come off as a troll, but I find it hard to believe that a set released every couple of months is overwhelming. If people can read books, and magazines, how is it so hard to remember abilities on a card? I think the issue is more that people don't have time to play with all of them. +1. We're talking about how new players are overwhelmed when getting into the game (or at least, that's what I was referring to.) A set released every couple of months is that much more for a newbie to learn who is just getting into the game.
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FlyingArrow wrote:corranhorn wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Not really. There's also not a regional in DE. You know where we just started having regionals? New Zealand. Any chance of having a regional in DE? LeftiesWillRule organized last year's but I haven't heard from him recently. I sure hope so, I'd jump at the chance to go. If there's interest we could organise one.
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would be interesting to see a number of players at each regional not counting those who go to multiply regionals beyond the first regional they played in and then do the same next year and compare those numbers or even compare those number with the numbers from gen con this year
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Whether its individual playgroups or just buddies getting together to play mini's people are free to ban whatever they like or just decide to not use select characters for a given night.
And while some people don't like particular characters the meta is as close to wide open as its ever been right now so I can't see any reason to ban a certain piece from competitive play. And it's at the competitive level (i.e. Regionals, GenCon, other organized tournaments) where that would matter because again you can play however you want locally.
Participation in this game has indeed dropped off significantly since WotC quit. This great community of SWM players has kept things going quite well in the face of that challenge though. From how I see it this game is primarily going to attract new players through local groups or individuals exposing newcomers to the game. That's really the best you can do. So if keeping some things out of your local group helps keep the group intact that's great and you should do what you need to do.
Taking it beyond that level though you need to have a baseline to stick to and at the moment trying to impose bans is only going to create arguments that can never be resolved. Now if something gets through the design process and playtesting and turns out to be so severely broken that we revert back to either playing that squad or a hard counter for that squad in order to win competitively then there is a reason to start discussing a ban. I don't see any piece or pieces that effect things like that right now.
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trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Here's the evidence that speaks most clearly to me: in 2010 when WotC dropped the game, we had 64 players in the Championship at Gencon...last year in 2012, we had 38 players in the Championship. The numbers have been decreasing every year. I'm curious how many we'll have this year in 2013. So, according to the biggest competitive tournament in the game, we've lost almost half of our players. This is talking about the competitive scene though; the local scene is harder to quantify. I think it's pretty clear that there are less and less active SWM players all the time. People move on, life moves on, etc. I will keep playing for decades, and I'll never sell my collection, and I'm pretty sure there are many many people with similar plans. But let's not pretend that SWM as an active game is still going as strong as ever.
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thereisnotry wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Here's the evidence that speaks most clearly to me: in 2010 when WotC dropped the game, we had 64 players in the Championship at Gencon...last year in 2012, we had 38 players in the Championship. The numbers have been decreasing every year. I'm curious how many we'll have this year in 2013. So, according to the biggest competitive tournament in the game, we've lost almost half of our players. This is talking about the competitive scene though; the local scene is harder to quantify. I think we need at least 2 GenCons in a row with significantly lower player numbers to draw big conclusions. For all we know A binch of things came up around Gen Con.
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corranhorn wrote:thereisnotry wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Here's the evidence that speaks most clearly to me: in 2010 when WotC dropped the game, we had 64 players in the Championship at Gencon...last year in 2012, we had 38 players in the Championship. The numbers have been decreasing every year. I'm curious how many we'll have this year in 2013. So, according to the biggest competitive tournament in the game, we've lost almost half of our players. This is talking about the competitive scene though; the local scene is harder to quantify. I think we need at least 2 GenCons in a row with significantly lower player numbers to draw big conclusions. For all we know A bunch of things came up around Gen Con. I don't have the numbers in my head for 2011, but if someone wants to do the research, they'll find that it has been a steady decrease each year. In fact, I know from my own experience at Gencon that the numbers have been decreasing every year for the past 5 years. Another way to quantify the bleed of the game is to count the number of Regionals and the attendance at those Regionals. Again, I don't have those numbers handy, but they are living proof that the game is slowly bleeding. I'll continue to be as enthusiastically involved in SWM as before, but I'm not going to pretend either.
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thereisnotry wrote:corranhorn wrote:thereisnotry wrote:trappedslider wrote:Darth_Reignir wrote:I'm just going to ask this:
Where is the evidence that the player base is dwindling the lack of a regional in Mo is evidence for one thing Here's the evidence that speaks most clearly to me: in 2010 when WotC dropped the game, we had 64 players in the Championship at Gencon...last year in 2012, we had 38 players in the Championship. The numbers have been decreasing every year. I'm curious how many we'll have this year in 2013. So, according to the biggest competitive tournament in the game, we've lost almost half of our players. This is talking about the competitive scene though; the local scene is harder to quantify. I think we need at least 2 GenCons in a row with significantly lower player numbers to draw big conclusions. For all we know A bunch of things came up around Gen Con. I don't have the numbers in my head for 2011, but if someone wants to do the research, they'll find that it has been a steady decrease each year. In fact, I know from my own experience at Gencon that the numbers have been decreasing every year for the past 5 years. Another way to quantify the bleed of the game is to count the number of Regionals and the attendance at those Regionals. Again, I don't have those numbers handy, but they are living proof that the game is slowly bleeding. I'll continue to be as enthusiastically involved in SWM as before, but I'm not going to pretend either. Well if all that's true than I agree.
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